Rep. Dennis Kucinich is presenting articles of impeachment for Bush on C-SPAN on the floor of the House. It is a 35-count resolution. Last year he endeavored to launch impeachment against Cheney, a resolution that has yet to be acted upon.
PAD
Rep. Dennis Kucinich is presenting articles of impeachment for Bush on C-SPAN on the floor of the House. It is a 35-count resolution. Last year he endeavored to launch impeachment against Cheney, a resolution that has yet to be acted upon.
PAD
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President Cheney. That has a nice ring to it. Go get ’em Kucinich!
And McClellan said on Countdown that his upcoming testimony would support those articles of impeachment….
He makes me happy I’m not in his district…
“President” Cheney wouldn’t even happen, considering that the impeachment process would only implicate him as well.
Wildcat
Isn’t it a little late at this point?
I’ve got to agree with Susan here. While I’d love to see this twit tossed out of office and arrested, I’ve reconciled myself to the fact that it’s not going to happen … and I’m not sure bringing it up now, seven months before he’s leaving anyway, would accomplish much beyond getting a lot of Republicans fired up about the 2008 election.
TWL
There’s a little thing called justice. Whether it’s politically convenient to try these folks should not be a question. The question is are they guilty of the crimes they’re accused of. If so, they should be brought to justice. There has to be accountability. If they committed these crimes and get away with it, what’s to stop future administrations, Republican or Democrats, from doing the same or worse?
While I don’t think for a second that the political environment would allow for President Bush to actually be found guilty in the Senate, a successful impeachment would serve several real and symbolic purposes.
As to the real: it’s been a few years since I read the constitution, but impeachment has effects beyond drumming a guy out of office. There’s also something about not being elligible for holding any position of honor in the government or some such. Basically IIRC, Bush would be precluded from holding any type of appointed position in the U.S. government. On a more practical note, once he was impeached, he would then be subject to regular criminal charges for all the stuff that came out in the impeachment trial. I was going to write something about it also meaning that he’d wouldn’t be pardoning a zillion of his minions as he left office because he’d have run out of it before January, but then I realized that Cheney would simply do the same thing. I realize that I’m already moving into the fantasy realm where enough Republican Senators would vote to impeach Bush even if there was live footage of him eating infants, but I don’t think that time would allow for the impeachment of both Bush and Cheney, even if they’d vote to convict.
On the symbolic level, impeaching Bush out of office would have immense value in showing that there are certain things that the U.S. will simply not allow its President to get away with. I think that some sort of official finding by the government that the Bush Administration was a bunch of crooks is essential to putting a stop to the precedent of being able to get away with stuff like that and would go a long way to repairing our standing in the world.
Sounds like someones building his portfolio for the next election.
Seriously, dont you think, if this had any credibility, the Democratic run House and Senate would have jumped all over it?
From Wikipedia:
Impeachment is the first of two stages in a specific process for a legislative body to remove a government official without that official’s agreement. The second stage is conviction.
Impeachment is so rare that the term can be misunderstood. A typical misconception is to confuse it with involuntary removal from office; in fact, it is only a legal statement of charges, paralleling an indictment in criminal law. An official who is impeached faces a second legislative vote (whether by the same body or another), which determines conviction, or failure to convict, on the charges embodied by the impeachment.
Kucinich is the best friend republicans have. Thank you for doing something so politically divisive this close to an election, and helping motivate Republican and Swing Voters! McCain just got one step closer to the White House.
David Hunt say: On the symbolic level, impeaching Bush out of office would have immense value in showing that there are certain things that the U.S. will simply not allow its President to get away with. I think that some sort of official finding by the government that the Bush Administration was a bunch of crooks is essential to putting a stop to the precedent of being able to get away with stuff like that and would go a long way to repairing our standing in the world.
Was the same symbolic value achieved when Bill
Clinton was impeached? I personally dont think it did. How many times are they going to beat this? The same info the Bush admin. was using is the same info the Clinton Admin. was using. The Intel was not perfect, it had flaws.
David Hunt –
Basically IIRC, Bush would be precluded from holding any type of appointed position in the U.S. government.
I rather doubt that that’s going to be an issue anyways.
Jerry Wall –
McCain just got one step closer to the White House.
And as soon as McCain agrees with Bush on anything, he’ll take another step back.
Craig J. Ries: And as soon as McCain agrees with Bush on anything, he’ll take another step back.
It will be interesting to watch McCain try to distance himself from Bush without ending up agreeing with Obama.
Susan O. asked:
“Isn’t it a little late at this point?”
Nope. Never too late to get it on the record, and that is what Kucinich is doing. It will now be a permanent part of the Congressional Record.
I think both Bush and Cheney (as well as a few others) are war criminals, and they should be handed over to the International Court for trial.
Why the hëll isn’t he introdicing legislation involving an initiative to reduce our dependence on foreign oil? Or oil, period?
Congress… feh! They’re as useless as a raincoat in the Sahara.
R. Maheras –
They’re as useless as a raincoat in the Sahara.
Well, if the raincoat offers UV protection, then it isn’t totally useless.
So, you should go with my favorite: as useless as a condom in the Vatican. 😉
President Cheney. That has a nice ring to it. Go get ’em Kucinich!
That’s exactly why he introduced the resolution against Cheney first, last year.
I like Kucinich, but I like him in a similar way to how I like Don Quixote.
Was the same symbolic value achieved when Bill Clinton was impeached? I personally dont think it did. How many times are they going to beat this? The same info the Bush admin. was using is the same info the Clinton Admin. was using. The Intel was not perfect, it had flaws.
1) As QHS pointed out, he wasn’t successfully impeached. The House voted in articles, but the Senate declined to convict him. You will note that I wrote (sadly) several times about the odds of the Senate actually convicting GWB.
2) Clinton was impeached because he lied about an extra-marital affair. GWB and his cronies lied us into a war with Iraq (see the report from the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence release last week after being delayed for three years by Republicans) and broke a truckload of surveillance laws after Congress was kind enough to amend those laws (at his request) to make it easier for his Administration to fight terrorism. Bush’s signing statement of the USA Patriot Act praises the law for how it updates FISA to the new era and says how well it will let law enforcement combat terrorism. He immediately started breaking this law. Oh, and his Administration opposed offers from Congress to further expand surveillance options in FISA during his first term because they thought any further expansion of those powers would make people caught by it unconvcitable due to gross violation of their fourth amendment rights. It was only they got caught with their ear to America’s wall that they started clamoring about how outdated the 2001 update of FISA was and how they needed more spying powers.
I’m going to stop myself before I get totally out of control. I will simply point to the same SSCI report as a counter to your “same intelligence” comment.
Clinton was impeached because he lied about an extra-marital affair.
Actually, Clinton was impeached for committing perjury in a court of law. In specific, he was impeached on two counts:grand jury perjury and obstruction of justice. The fact of the matter is he did lie before a grand jury, and did commit perjury.
Present your evidence for impeaching Bush and make your argument, but start from a position of intellectual honesty when referring to the other side, otherwise all your statements become diminished.
I never said that I thought that Clinton shouldn’t have been impeached for lying under oath. I think that he was the subject of a political witch-hunt and I think that he should have never been put into the position of even answering those questions under oath, but since he then chose to lie about it…I can at least see that the case can be made for voting on articles of impeachment. However, one of the big reasons that the Senate couldn’t seal the deal with a conviction is that too many of the Senators saw it for the political hatchet-job that is was.
As to arguments for an impeachment of Bush. I’m at work now (I left just after my last comment) and I can’t go hunting for that while I’m here. I didn’t see his speech in the Huuse, but I expect Dennis Kucinich has made that case well enough for me. If I remember after work, I’ll hunt down some sources on how Bush’s domestic spying program was grossly illegal and should have landed him in prison.
If nothing else, there should at least be a record of lawmakers who vote against impeachment.
Kudos to QHS for pointing out that “impeachment” is not synonymous with “running him out of office.”
I’m of the mind that running Bush out of office while Cheney is still in a position to succeed him would do more harm than good. Getting rid of Cheney first would have been the way to go.
Im more inclined to follow Websters definition then The “Dreaded” Wikipedia
Here’s Websters:
1 a: to bring an accusation against b: to charge with a crime or misdemeanor; specifically : to charge (a public official) before a competent tribunal with misconduct in office c: to remove from office especially for misconduct
2: to cast doubt on; especially : to challenge the credibility or validity of
He’s not the only one-Wexler wants answers, and sweating these clowns under the flourescent lights in front of a mic would make my decade: (apologies for length)
Dear XXXXX,
Our campaign for accountability for the Bush administration is making legitimate progress.
I am pleased to announce to you that the House Judiciary Committee has met my public call for Scott McClellan’s immediate testimony with action:
Today, Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers officially invited Mr. McClellan to testify under oath on Friday, June 20th at 10AM.
After all of our hard work pushing for impeachment hearings for Vice President Cheney – the McClellan hearing provides our cause with a legitimate opportunity to showcase the crimes and violations of this Administration for the American people, the mainstream media, reluctant members of the Democratic party, and sensible Republicans. This hearing provides us our first genuine opportunity to enter the public consciousness and change the dynamics that have prevented true accountability for Bush and Cheney.
Mr. McClellan was a major figure in the Valerie Plame/CIA scandal, as well as a leading propagandist for the Bush White House’s deliberate attempts to hide the true costs of this war from the American public. As such, Mr. McClellan will testify under oath (and be subject to perjury charges should he lie) and be asked about the following matters:
What role did President Bush, Vice President Cheney , and key administration officials take in the effort to reveal the identity of covert CIA agent Valeria Plame Wilson – thus destroying her network and putting lives in jeopardy?
What role did President Bush, Vice President Cheney, and key administration officials take regarding the firing of U.S. Attorneys or political reasons?
What role did President Bush, Vice President Cheney, key administration officials take in conspiring to blatantly break U.S. and International laws prohibiting the use of torture?
I call on Mr. McClellen to immediately accept this invitation and testify under oath as he previously agreed to while being interviewed on national television.
During the hearing I will have roughly five short minutes to question Mr. McClellan and undercover the illegalities committed by this Administration – which is why it is critically important that every representative on the Judiciary Committee hears your voice. Please let them know that you demand answers to these questions.
Nor should it stop there: Karl Rove has thumbed his nose to the Judiciary Committee’s subpoena – joining Harriet Miers, Joshua Bolten and Vice President Cheney’s Chief of Staff David Addington as the only Administration officials in history to claim Congress has no power to even bring them before a committee to be questioned.
1) As QHS pointed out, he wasn’t successfully impeached. The House voted in articles, but the Senate declined to convict him. You will note that I wrote (sadly) several times about the odds of the Senate actually convicting GWB.
Clinton WAS succesfully impeached. It is an entirely separate thing from removal. This gets confused almost as much as the immaculate conception.
Also, despite what some think, being impeached has little to no long term ramifications. Clinton is not prohibited from running for office. Giving up his ability to practice law for a time was part of his plea deal with the prosecuter, not anything that was forced by being impeached.
Furthermore, being impeached is not needed for criminal proceedings to occur. Nixon never got impeached but he would have faced criminal charges had he not been pardoned.
I expect this to get about as far as the Cheney impeachment effort.
Although I could see where Hillary could use this her advantage–spearhead the impeachment effort, get some massive street cred with the left (while Obama loses same support by urging attention to the issues he wants to focus on) and manage to hurt Obama’s chances in a way that will not be obvious and not get her the condemantion from her left that other sabatoge efforts would. And it would keep her in the news, which is something she is probably missing right about now.
The latest “feel good” ploy by a democrat politician.
Seriously, the Dems have been in control of the house and senate for almost 2 years and what, exactly, do they have to show for it? Other than a few things, not much.
Unless this does go somewhere, I don’t see it motivating many on either side.
So enjoy the show. I am more worried about real issues like the families hit by the tornado a few weeks ago and the up to 1000 who will have evacuate due to flooding in this area.
Iowa Jim
As others have said, Clinton WAS impeached. He wasn’t convicted, but he was impeached. And the law cited about the questions he lied about were part of a sexual harassment law that he himself signed into law.
But back to the original topic… PAD missed one little detail. House Republicans pushed — hard — for Kucinich’s impeachment bill to be brought to a vote. It was the Democratic leadership that throttled that plan. Republicans knew that, politically, it was only to their benefit to push for Kucinich’s bill to go to a vote, and it was the Democrats who knew it would kill them.
J.
Iowa Jim said:
“So enjoy the show. I am more worried about real issues like the families hit by the tornado a few weeks ago and the up to 1000 who will have evacuate due to flooding in this area.”
Jim, as stated many years ago…
“All politics is local.”
Everything that happens at the national level affects everybody everywhere. We have ignored Global Climate Change for 7 years now, and the results are making themselves known by Mother Nature everywhere around the world. This Spring’s devastating weather is caused by Global Climate Change. I’m not saying it wouldn’t have still been a stormy spring, but the size of the areas being devastated should be a clear warning note.
I listened to ABD News tonight. Among the things they reported:
2/3 of Indiana is declared to be in a state of emergency.
The famed tourist resort Wisconsin Dells is gone—the lake where the Wisconsin Dells are broke out of its banks and the water entered the nearby river.
Part of the Mississippi River IS CLOSED TO BARGE TRAFFIC because it is too dangerous to navigate. This will mean higher costs for transportation.
Much of Minnesota’s crops for this year are in danger.
Congress pretty much ignored Global Climate Change until the Democrats re-took the majority. This goes back to the constant attempt to pin SOMETHING on Clinton, maybe all the way back to 1994.
Iowa Jim said:
“Seriously, the Dems have been in control of the house and senate for almost 2 years and what, exactly, do they have to show for it? Other than a few things, not much.”
There is actually little point to arguing this statement, as you seem content to parrot the ignorance of the truth.
Democrats having the majority in Congress does not mean that the Democrats can do whatever they want, and you know this.
A filibuster can stop legislation. A new record for filibusters was set last year by the Republican party in the House. It was the highest EVER number of filibusters during any Congress…
…and it was set in ONE—1—ONE year, not two. The previous record was set in a full 2-year Congressional session. A new record set in half the time.
Now, either you are upset about the plight of your neighbors and are lashing out at the Democrats in Congress, in which case we can understand your concern and worry, or…you are being willfully ignorant of the truth. That, Jim, is truly unforgivable.
>>Rep. Dennis Kucinich is presenting articles of impeachment for Bush on C-SPAN on the floor of the House. It is a 35-count resolution. Last year he endeavored to launch impeachment against Cheney, a resolution that has yet to be acted upon>Nope. Never too late to get it on the record, and that is what Kucinich is doing. It will now be a permanent part of the Congressional Record.>I think both Bush and Cheney (as well as a few others) are war criminals, and they should be handed over to the International Court for trial.< The above comment brought to you by the Looney Left. Hrmphhh! Assdom continues here. Sneer!
And Jimmie J, as we can all see, is uniquely qualified to recognize looniness and the continuation of Assdom.
Jimmie — grownups are talking. Off to bed now.
TWL
We have ignored Global Climate Change for 7 years now, and the results are making themselves known by Mother Nature everywhere around the world. This Spring’s devastating weather is caused by Global Climate Change. I’m not saying it wouldn’t have still been a stormy spring, but the size of the areas being devastated should be a clear warning note.
Alan, that’s not science. Saying that any particular weather event is caused by “global climate change” is completely unverifiable. Unless by “global climate change” you mean the weather, which is global and always changing. I’m assuming you mean human caused global change.
It’s frustrating to me because I think there is a good chance that we are seeing effects from increased CO2 levels but too much of the science has simply become too entangled with politics to be of any more use than a creationist screed.
Just tell me this–what possible summer could we have that would be evidence that there is NO human caused global change? Hotter than average? Colder than average? Nobody dies from any weather related events whatsoever?
Well, TIMMY (using Costanza-speak), ya’ll hang together, watch your clever little Daily Show think you have all the answers. Dippy Dennis Kucinich and War Crimes. Looney Lefties: pleasant to be with. Cuckoo! Cuckoo!
David Hunt wrote:
1) As QHS pointed out, he wasn’t successfully impeached. The House voted in articles, but the Senate declined to convict him. You will note that I wrote (sadly) several times about the odds of the Senate actually convicting GWB.
Others have already pointed it out, but I’ll reiterate: Clinton was indeed impeached. However, impeachment is only the bringing of formal charges. The conviction is a separate thing from the impeachment.
Scotus judges went on record 2 years ago that Bush was guilty of a war crime. They ruled that someone wrongly tried — absolutely at the discretion of a presidential privilege in the UCMJ — was instead protected by Geneva conventions until it could be demonstrated otherwise. If a documented ruling by supreme court judges can’t qualify a war crime, what more do you need, dìçkhëád?
I wish Dennis Kucinich would spend more time focusing on H. R. 2977, the Space Preservation Act he introduced, which would, among other lofty goals, ban the use of “psychotronic” and “extraterrestrial” space weapons.
The man is on the cutting edge, I tell you.
Bill,
Well, I guess he doesn’t feel we’ll need such things once he creates a “Department of Peace”. Cutting edge, indeed.
Dennis Kucinich: whotta a jerk (with bad hair)
And a national forum, an impressive job, and a smoking hot wife. If you ever grow up, have a career, or get an opportunity to have sex, you might appreciate those.
PAD
Yeah, you have to give the man that. Actually, with both Michelle and Cindy easy on the eyes and even also-rans like Jeri Thompson, we are truly entering a golden age of potential first ladies.
This is being done for one simple reason – yes, it’s too late to really do anything damaging to Bush’s lame duck last 7 months, but it is an attempt to get Republicans in the House and Senate on the record as to whether they agree or not, in the face of overwhelming evidence, that George Bush repeatedly violated the Constitution while in office. Divisive? You betcha… but it has a good chance of driving those swing voters towards Obama unless McCain now comes out and says “yep, Bush was a criminal.” Of course if McCain does that, how does he explain being all buddy-buddy with Bush?
PAD,
I have to give you those three. I think it was “The Daily Show” that had a segment calling her a “FLILF”. Funny stuff.
Scott Bland,
Many Americans do not find the evidence nearly as “overwhelming” as you claim. My guess is hat people actually have to vote on this, it would favor Republicans – and maybe even Obama depending on how he voted. With the subprime situation and a War going on in Iraq, the thought that Congress would spend (notice I didn’t say waste since your mileage may very) time on this and whether the Patriots were punished severely enogh for cheating during a game rather than debating true alternatives to our present situation energy wise or discussing how we may be actually winning Iraq will strike many except for the most rabid Bush-haters as outrageous.
PAD,
I have to give you those three. I think it was “The Daily Show” that had a segment calling her a “FLILF”. Funny stuff.
Scott Bland,
Many Americans do not find the evidence nearly as “overwhelming” as you claim. My guess is hat people actually have to vote on this, it would favor Republicans – and maybe even Obama depending on how he voted. With the subprime situation and a War going on in Iraq, the thought that Congress would spend (notice I didn’t say waste since your mileage may very) time on this and whether the Patriots were punished severely enogh for cheating during a game rather than debating true alternatives to our present situation energy wise or discussing how we may be actually winning Iraq will strike many except for the most rabid Bush-haters as outrageous.
Dennis Kucinich: whotta a jerk (with bad hair)
>>And a national forum, an impressive job, and a smoking hot wife. If you ever grow up, have a career, or get an opportunity to have sex, you might appreciate those.< PAD WOW, a personal attack from Little Petey (formerly BIIIG Petey). I should be honored! Nutty Dennis is taken reeealll serious: by about 1% of the people. YOU take him VERY seriously. You're one of the Looney Lefties-of COURSE you do! I'm reading your personal attack again. I'm amazed you had the time to hack your attack out on your blog-you're such a busy guy. Bowling not on ESPN tonight? Mets choke AGAIN??-oh, I see they lost 9-5 to Arizona. BWAHAHAHA!!! THAT explains it. Regarding my sex life: Look at me. Now look at you. Trust me on this. It's no contest. I win.
Jerome,
Yes, there are some Americans that do not see the overwhelming evidence, even when it is put right in front of their face. Despite being provided direct quotes from Bush saying what the laws were in regards to wiretaps (and claiming that he followed them) and then an outright admission from Bush that he intentionally and knowingly violated those laws, some Americans would still refuse to see what was going on. These are the same people that still believe Saddam Hussein was personally responsible for 9/11 (another proven lie of this administration). We call them crazy people, and can only hope that when push comes to shove, there aren’t as many of them as we fear there are.
The simple fact that you would dare compare the numerous crimes and misdeeds of this administration to a football game controversy makes me sorely tempted to put you in that category also, but for now I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.
As far as our energy situation and the war in Iraq goes, just what is your suggestion? Right now the big oil companies own our government. Want to change that? Vote the people out (Dem or Repub) that take money from big oil. Don’t let the next president be someone beholden to them and their lobbyists. The war in Iraq? As long as the current administration is in place, nothing will be done. Anyone that has Bush’s ear that dares to imply that he’s doing things wrong is simply dismissed and replaced. Don’t want it to continue? Don’t put a man in the White House that has promised to continue the failed policies.
I’m betting for Jimmie’s disemvowelling by 12:30 — the peak of hunger before the next meal.
It’s really kind of flattering in a perverse sort of way: Jimmie’s thoroughly up on all my hobbies and interests (just for the record, bowling is on every day at noon EST on ESPN Classics.) What sort of tragically dull life must he lead that he goes out of his way to hang with people he obviously despises? Heaven knows I would never bother to seek out conservative websites (which there are in abundance, I’m sure) to crave attention from the denizens therein. He obviously has plenty of time on his hands. Must be the total lack of a social life that provides it to him.
At any rate, done with him now.
PAD
Actually, I’m writing this at work at I job I enjoy. My social life is very good. I enjoy a good novel or comic. My life is far from dull and I get a kick out of reading the Leftie chatter here. This blog is a great place to check in and get some laughs. Ol’ Petey, you’ve spoken many times of your hobbies and interests. Actually, I like bowling. Used to be in leagues years ago and took it quite seriously. I couldn’t watch reruns of old bowling matches on ESPN Classics but that’s just me. The Mets, well, I can’t take seriously. They are pathetic and the GM, a hero to many Mets fans a short year ago, should be run out of town. The farm system is a disaster. You got personal with me so I returned the favor. I won the exchange but now ‘you’re done with me’. I came back. P.S. – Dennis Kucinich’s wife is a babe but he still has really bad hair.
“I won the exchange.” Guys, remind me…there was some nimrod poster who kept saying that. I’ve blanked on who it was, but I’m suspecting it’s the same idiot except under a different name now. Anyone care to remind me? Because if it’s someone I shrouded, then that’s all I need to know.
PAD
>>”I won the exchange.” Guys, remind me…there was some nimrod poster who kept saying that. I’ve blanked on who it was, but I’m suspecting it’s the same idiot except under a different name now. Anyone care to remind me? Because if it’s someone I shrouded, then that’s all I need to know.< Pete, it wasn't me. I'm a rare contributor to this blog. Oh, yeah, now that I have your attention... I enjoy Fallen Angel. Read them all and will continue. One suggestion-no more character crossovers. The Shi issues were undoubtedly sub-standard.