No fun puppets to be seen this week, and not a lot of smiles to go around.
Smallville: Being a brand new friend of Clark Kent’s is becoming almost as hazardous a pastime as being an old friend of Jessica Fletcher’s. This time around, a friend of Clark’s has to deal with his brother, who dies, only to be brought back to life through an injection of Clark’s blood, which it’s now being implied might have some sort of amazing restorative properties. But with the older brother dying again, the younger brother straps a bomb on his chest and demands an immediate liver transplant for his dying sibling or he’ll blow the whole place to kingdom come, all while Pa Kent’s having open heart surgery…
Okay. I think I know what’s starting to bother me. What made “Smallville” work was that it was essentially “Dawson’s Creek” with one outlandish gimme: The meteor shower which brought us Clark and Kryptonite…earth’s greatest hero and the hero’s greatest weakness, all in one shot. That’s fine. But as the mythos builds and builds, I’m starting to be hit with stuff I’m having a tough time believing. Clark’s an alien. Human blood is complicated stuff. One human can’t even transfer to another without killing him unless the blood’s been typed and matched. So the notion that this alien blood could interact at all with human blood and do anything else other than kill the recipient…or, if the recipient’s dead, make him even deader…is starting to push at the outer reaches of my suspension of disbelief.
Suspension of disbelief is a delicate thing. For instance, I’m willing to believe that Clark is faster than a speeding bullet. On that basis, the end fell apart for me as Clark stood there completely flat footed as a bullet cracks through the window and takes out his friend, but triggering the bomb. Clark is then fast enough to grab lead sheeting, throw it over the bomb, and get it to a safe detonation point miles away, all within seconds…but he couldn’t stop the bullet in the first place?! His superhearing didn’t pick up the gun firing? His super speed didn’t allow him to see the bullet coming? His heat vision couldn’t melt the bullet? What the hëll–?!
The show’s been so solid most of the season, but in recent episodes the endings have been dodgy at best. Fingers crossed on next week’s Adam episode.
Angel: The surface reaction is that, aw cripes, not ANOTHER possessed female becoming the antagonist?!? My supposition is that Mutant Enemy knew way before us that the WB wasn’t continuing the series, and we’re seeing some fast dancing to try and wrap things up, because between the abrupt vanishing of Lindsay and the sudden turn of events, it feels like the season’s been yanked in one direction and then another.
But surface reaction aside, this is not a mere rehashing of Evil Cordy (or even Dark Willow.) Instead, in this Whedon-scripted episode, the real story is seeing how their year-long association with W&H has eviled-up the Fang Gang. I mean, my God: Wes casually shoots an annoying associate in the leg, Lorne threatens to kill Eve on the spot and clearly means it, Gunn (as near as we can tell) crushes the skull of a helpless opponent. And the most terrifying of all: When Angel learns that saving Fred would literally cost the lives of thousands of people, his response is, “To hëll with the world.” His rationale is clear: He’s spent a century saving millions of lives; the world owes him a few thousand. He’s ready to sacrifice unknown thousands for the sake of one person.
The place where Whedon falls down, unfortunately, is that he gives Angel an easy out. The decision point never reaches fruition because events with Fred outstrip his ability to forestall them. What the episode was building toward, and failed to deliver, was an Angel/Spike confrontation in which Angel is ready to make good on his intent to save Fred no matter what the cost, and Spike endeavors to stop him. What a climax that would have been, particularly if it had come down to a final battle atop that hole through the world.
Instead it was almost as if they ran out of either time or budget. The major dramatic point they were building toward never paid off. Granted, Whedon likes to defy expectations, and that’s fine as far as it goes. But the expectation here was a grand, almost epic finale with the underlying theme of a corrupted good in direct conflict with evil seeking salvation. Instead we got Fred with a punk hairdo. The trick is to defy expectations without letting them down, and I feel as if that’s what happened here.
Although you did have to love the beginning of Fred assuring her parents she’d lead a normal, quiet life, and then we smash cut to Fred going Ellen Ripley on some critters. And Angel with the sword through him with the insect on the other end was priceless.
West Wing: Due to a recording glitch, I missed the first eighteen minutes, but between the coming attractions and the subsequent story, I’m pretty sure I’ve got the whole episode.
Although the writing and execution were solid, I’m disturbed by the direction they’ve gone with Hoynes. Previously Hoynes was a decent man whom Bartlet trusted implicitly (remember the “Because I might die” note he wrote to explain why they should keep Hoynes on the ticket?) I mean, jeez, he told Hoynes about the MS years before he told Leo. So now it turns out Hoynes is an untrustworthy creep who was womanizing for years (including, apparently, bagging CJ!) and is ready to trash his former colleagues for political gain to cover his own lapses. I mean, yes, there are people whom you trust who turn out to be dirtbags. That happens in life. The problem is that it diminishes everyone else in the series who ever trusted him, up to and including Bartlet, because they were so completely wrong about the type of person he was. It’s like we’re backsliding to the beginning of the season, when the characters were being turned so completely around that they were barely recognizable as themselves.
And I’m afraid the trend is only continuing. Next week, we’re told, someone has “set up” the Bartlet daughters to look bad. Unless I completely miss my guess, that someone is Will Bailey (Toby’s talking to someone wearing glasses in the trailer: That means either Will or Leo, and I’m thinking it ain’t Leo.) I’ve been complaining about the marginalizing of Sorkin favorite Josh Molina, and now I’m worried they’re going to be forcing him out of the series altogether. It’s like the entire Bartlet administration is self-destructing before our eyes…which, again, admittedly happens in real life. But I don’t need to watch “West Wing” for that. I can tune in CNN or read history books. This was once a series about decent people trying to pull together; not indecent people pulling each other apart.
• 
Angel
The episode may have tapered off a bit, but I bet the season itself is still building up to something great. I don’t think we’ve seen the end of the Hole. It’s just too cool.
Gee, can we cut Angel a break? I thought the actress who plays Fred did a fantastic job. I was really moved by seeing Wesley watch over her as she slowly died.
And, as for Angel’s actions, remember that it was already said that Angel would choose not to save Fred. Although what your propsoing does sound good too.
But I don’t think this was ment to be the end of the series. If they had propper time to end it, don’t you think they would end it with the great battle of good verus evil Angel (or Spike) is destined to participate in?
Oh, and I have to say I loved the development with Gunn. Seeing himself as the Conduity, and it not being his friend anymore – that just blew me away. “We already have your soul” Plus, it made for explaiantion as to why Gunn momentarily hesitated, but still went and killed Nox. But, most of all, was the supremely smooth way Gunn’s experience last episode lead to this Stone coffin being delivered to them.
West Wing:
You missed CJ back on the Taylor Reid show, incidentally…More as an equal, actually.
As to the “we can’t trust people” line, I’d wait and see. Frankly, I never liked Hoynes as a person (his best moments were so-so; mostly Leo and alcoholism).
There’s no guarantee that Will’s the bad guy in the next one, though…might as well wait to find out.
(If they do decide to write Malina out of the show, well, given that Sorkin has a new television project in the works, at least we know that Josh can find work. *grin*)
I guess the Angel episode worked a lot better for me in terms of story balance and set-up, and I thought Joss played up some good contrasts. Highlights for me were:
1. The opening. I agree, the quick-cut to the hive battle was nicely done, while Angel and Spike’s bickering “post stabbing” entrance was priceless.
2. “You mean we should start annoying other people?” I love the set-up of Angel deciding Spike’s presence is just messing with his mental state, while Spike is claiming to be staying out of habit. But by the end of the episode, the two of them are not only fighting like a well-oiled machine united in a common goal, they’re doing so like old friends who are forgetting the past and doing what’s right. Seeing them at the end of the episode, it makes me view their opening scenes in a different light, like what is it that’s being UNsaid between them? Could it be that Angel doesn’t want Spike around because he’s grudgingly starting to RESPECT him?
3. The quick-cuts of Lorne’s gun-shot reaction to Fred’s singing and her not-quite-off-camera insta-sick was not just like a cold hand on my chest… It was like a cold fist holding a canned ham whalloping me in the chest. Repeatedly.
4. Everyone’s throat-lump inducing speeches, especially Spikes, swearing how they’re going to save Fred no matter what the cost… Only to see in hindsight how hollow those heroic poses were when faced witht he consequences.
5. The interrogation of Eve. Angel and Spike doing the two “bad Cop” routines when suddenly… >WHAM<. An unexpected even WORSE cop. I’ve gotten so used to Lorne being the soul of sunshine that I’ve forgotten that he’s a freaking demon. Given the world he came from, no matter how much he’s denied his heritage, it’s easy to see how er… “Passionate” he’d be about seeking vengeance for someone he loved. But you still don’t see it coming.
6. The mixture of anguish and guilt on Gunn’s face when he realizes the full consequences of his actions… An expression that he still wears as he lashes out at the only person he can blame more easily than himself.
7. The acting on behalf of Mr. Denisoff and Miss Acker. We’ve been rooting for these two to get together on screen for so long, only to see it all crumble, and dámņëd if those two didn’t wring every bit of heartbreak out of it.
8. The final scene with Spike and Angel at the well. Okay, I have to say it worked better for me than for PAD, probably because I may have been reading too much into it. It seemed to me that Angel was trying to justify to himself that saving Fred was worth the risk, but knew he shouldn’t. It actually looked like the decision was killing him. While Spike’s little speech… While it may seem out of place, it looked to me like Spike just wanted to talk about something, ANYTHING, to avoid saying what they were both thinking: We have to let her go, we’re the good guys.
Whew. Okay, I think I’ve put enough of a long-winded post here.
Cheers!
Of course Clark didn’t hear or see the bullet. His back was to the sniper, and most rifle bullets travel faster than the speed of sound. You might argue whether the window slowed the bullet down below Mach 1, but then Clark’s only clue is hearing shattering glass behind him, not a gunshot.
Angel:
I was kinda expecting some type of conflict between Angel & Spike regarding Fred. However, I can see Spike standing aside. Fred is the member of the Fang Gang that he is the closest to. She sweated blood to save him when he was a pseudo-ghost. Also, in recent episodes, although he and Angel are still antagonistic to each other, their conversations with each other are indicative of a certain amount of underlying respect toward each other. Besides, I think Spike knew he couldn’t have won against Angel if his heart wasn’t in it. And trying to keep Angel from saving Fred, I don’t think his heart would have been in it. He really strikes me as someone cares much more about the person metaphorically right in front of him as opposed to people in general.
Also, if Nox set up the whole Brain-Boost scam, then the guy who did the procedure has to have been in on it. That’s a lead that Gunn should be following up on in the search for more information about just how screwed they all are. It makes me wonder how many people at Wolfram & Hart are in on the whole scheme and how high up the conspiracy reaches. Are the Senior Partners, themselves, trying to raise Illyria? Is her arrival the Appocalyspe that they’ve been trying to influence Angel’s participation in since Season 1? Could the SPs simply have been lackeys of Illyria from the beginning? How many questions can I string together?
So, since Angel knew where the mystery coffin came from, is there a good explanation as to why they didn’t bring it, and Fred, with them to the Deeper Well?
WEST WING:
As I commented in the other thread, that revelation about CJ and Hoynes was COMPLETELY out of the blue. I mean, having recently watched the whole first season on DVD, I picked up on some tension between CJ and VP Hoynes in those early episodes, but I wonder if Sorkin had considered this prospective story. Honestly, I’m not really happy about the revelation. I liked that it took me by surprise, but I don’t like the notion that CJ and Hoynes had a one-night affair 8 years prior, and we’re JUST hearing about it now, though it seemed like Toby and Josh and Leo already knew. I understand that writing such revelations involves taking some artistic liberties, but I didn’t buy it. It almost seemed like they were making Hoynes into a “Clinton-figure,” the womanizing rascal of the South. Maybe that’s just me, though. I’ll agree that it takes Hoynes in a bad direction, given the “Because I might die” statement, but Bartlet and Leo have also talked about how they “hated the last guy” when they mulled potential VP candidates.
I do agree, though, that it looks like Will Bailey is the one who “sets up” the Bartlet daughters, not just because of the glasses, though that’s part of it, but also because of the “It’s someone they know” and it works with the direction the writers are going, with Will starting to actively and aggressively campaign for Bingo Bob.
I honestly don’t know. Some weeks, I find this show really working for me. Other weeks, not so much. But I’m honestly on the fence about this episode.
Gotta disagree with PAD. I thought this episode was PERFECT. From start to finish, Joss just nailed it. What an amazing episode. Definitly one of Joss’s best episodes. ‘A Hole In the World’ had everything that makes Angel great (humor, action, drama, etc). And it proves, once again, how stupid WB is to cancel this show.
I mean wow. This episode was just so great and so sad. Fred, Wes, Angel, Spike, Lorne, Gunn…heck even Eve and Knox (the recurring characters) pulled out great performances.
Definitly the best of the season so far (and thats saying a lot, imo, cause we’ve already had great episodes like ‘You’re Welcome’ and ‘Smile Time’ And other really good episodes, imo).
I think this season is going to end up being the best season of Angel. I know its already quickly becoming my favorite.
DF2506
” Thinks that evil Fred looks ALOT cooler then evil Cordy!!”
The solution to the problem of Fred’s demon inhabitant seemed so obvious to me. The problem is that it will ruin the lives of thousands of people as it travels from her body in California to its resting place in England. Solution: Bring Fred to England. Duh! (Of course, they did run out of time. Still, Angel and Spike didn’t know they were out of time and it is such a darn simple solution…)
When Angel learns that saving Fred would literally cost the lives of thousands of people, his response is, “To hëll with the world.” His rationale is clear: He’s spent a century saving millions of lives; the world owes him a few thousand. He’s ready to sacrifice unknown thousands for the sake of one person.
I recall Captain Kirk making the same decision in the original version of City On The Edge Of Forever as written by Harlan Ellison.
In the original, Kirk moves to save Edith Keeler from the oncoming truck knowing full well it will alter history and probably cost thousands (or millions) of lives. His response was pretty much the same as Angels in this episode.
So, since Angel knew where the mystery coffin came from, is there a good explanation as to why they didn’t bring it, and Fred, with them to the Deeper Well?
Two reasons for this:
1) He had no idea what the spell would entail.
2) I believe the spell returned Illyria from her resting place to the Deeper Well. As Knox said, her original place was in Los Angeles. So, in some odd way, she would have been sucked back to L.A., THEN back to the Well before being re-captured.
I may be off on that, but the first reason is still valid.
Also, I have to disagree with you, PAD. The Spike/Angel confrontation on what to do would have bored me to tears. The last thing I want to see is another “this is how we’re different” fight between Spike and Angel. Their differences were laid out quite plainly and in a quiet manner. I thought it was perfect.
Three points from other boards; it’s been pointed out that the song Eve sang was “LA”…last sung a few seasons back by one Lindsey.
And the whole “Cavemen vs. Astronauts” thing can be seen thematically as modern-day scientist Fred vs. pre-historic demon.
And finally, I’m not recalling where I saw this, but one of the writer/producer types was quoted as saying this season’s real love story was between Angel and Spike. Presumably platonic.
No Angel for five weeks after next week; the WB will be subbing in Viewer’s Choice Smallville eps.
Just 1 tning about Angel:
Gunn (as near as we can tell) crushes the skull of a helpless opponent
It’s not the first time we’ve seen Gunn kill someone. The only thing is that this time he hesitated. The last time he just aimed & fired (To keep Fred from doing the same).
Re: Angel
I thought it was a pretty good episode for a series that some people say is “winding down.” It was interesting to see how Fred’s situation could cause so many sudden shifts in character; Lorne ready to kill Eve? Wesley shooting that guy in the leg without a thought? And most of all, Angel and Spike, actually working together?!
I’m eagerly looking forward to the next episode with the “possessed” Fred.
Angel:
A hideous decision for Angel to make. I’m kind of glad in one way that he and Spike didn’t fight over it.
I can’t call it possessed Fred or evilFred, because I just saw Fred die, she’s gone. It’s not our Fred at all.
As for Gunn, it was the way he paused and looked around while killing Knox that got me.
“Why can’t I stay?”
Broke. My. Heart.
http://www.savingangel.com
Yeah I thought it was a very, very strong episode, filled with fluid storytelling, the crisp, funny, fast and gripping dialogue Joss can do so well, and some truly great characterization.
The basic plot is indeed ‘female member of the team taken over by ancient evil’ but how the story goes and what happens to the characters gives a totally diferent dynamic than the Cordy/Jasmin thing. So I don’t mind much. Those basic concepts are never what really matters anyway in these shows.
Spike and Angel’s relationship is indeed the love story of the season. I’d say brotherly love, since they clearly have the role of bossy older brother and pesky little brother in there, hehe.
As for PAD’s complaint, I disagree as well. Especially since this is clearly only the beginning of this storline, not the end. And we’ve seen them at each other’s throat a dozen times over. What was great here was how at first we see Angel pretty much accepting Spike as a force for good, inviting him along, but just not GETTING along with him. But his offer of funding Spike as an ‘off-shore’ champion shows his basic respect. Just can’t stand his company.
However, the point about them in this story, after all the enmity between them, we see that when push comes to shove they not only instantly drop everything to work together, but that they work extremely WELL together. Not unlike old friends, hehe.
And I expected Angel to not want to save Fred and Spike trying to. Doing it the other way around would’ve been cool too, but this….Angel saying ‘screw the world’ was a nice twist. But Spike didn’t stop him, and Angel still didn’t do it. This showed again how alike they really can be. It broke their heart (especially Angel’s) but both men are indeed champions when it comes down to it, knowing it would be wrong. Perhaps even knowing Fred herself wouldn’t want to live at the cost of so many people.
Great episode. And another example of how you can usually still tell when it’s Joss himself writing. Everything is just a little sharper and well-balanced and surprising. Good stuff. Lord I’m gonna miss this show.
(PS Has anyone noticed the Monty Python references? After fighting the Knights in england, they face an ancient guardian. And Spike’s questions “What’s your favorite color? etc.” echoed the questions at the bridge in “The Holy Grail”. Maybe I’m imagining it, but other people have noticed too on other boards.)
Angel
And wasn’t that a great line about Les Mis?
ANGEL: even though its winding down to a finale the show still rocks.Laughing my ášš off one week,edge of tears the next.Could not figure initially why this episode upset me then i realized its Fred suffering.They established early in the series she was a sweet innocent in an unusual situation.She is basically an example of what the crew wants to save and protect.Was very shocked by the reaction of Lorne (my favorite guy)and Wes with the shooting.Really Cordy leaving was bad ,Fred dying is worse.Cordy at least had a full life and growing up in sunnydale was used to the strangeness.Sorry to ramble about Fred but the last time a storyline upset me this badly when was when
Willow’s girlfriend was murdered.
Interested to see what comes next.Wes and Gunn’s situation,
Lornes view of Eve and her not toobright future
Much as it looks like Gunn went postal, I believe they clearly showed Knox alive in the trailer for next week’s episode. Gunn’s getting soft.
Maybe it is just me, but Cordy’s death was a lot more emotional for me. Perhaps it is just because I liked Cordy better, but Fred dying didn’t really have a huge impact on me. I’ve never been a fan of her character, so it was almost a non issue for me.
Wes on the otherhand, has grown into my second favorite Whedon character of all time (after Captain Mal). So seeing his reaction next week to Gunn will be awsome.
One final note. If the astronauts don’t have weapons then neither do the cavemen. Space men win hands down. They are trained.
West Wing: I don’t watch the show, but recording problems causing an eighteen minute gap in a White House recording? Has Archibald Cox been informed?
Smallville: My big problem with episode was the kryptonite bomb, which just seemed to come out of nowhere. It seemed so contrived to me – like in an old Green Lantern comic or Superfriends episode when something was suddenly inexplicably yellow. I realize it was relatively easily dealt with, but kryptonite on this show is starting to become a bit ridiculously ubiquitous.
Angel: Since they always follow up funny episodes with depressing ones, this didn’t surprise me that much. One thing I kept wondering though – couldn’t they just fly Fred closer to the big hole and then cast the spell? It was only a four hour trip; they could have at least discussed it. That occured to me as soon as they announced the spell problem – we could have seen Angel grab his cell phone, make a clal, say “something’s wrong”, and then cut to the evil Fred scene.
On top of that, there was always the aspect of “well, if we don’t cast the spell,what’s this resurrected evil demon-Fred going to do? Is she going to kill more people than the spell will?” And that may actually come up – at the end of the season, they realize that, had they cast the spell, fewer people would have died than if they had.
There’s also, of course, the third aspect to all this – was this the plan all along by the senior partners? Last week, we found out that the brain upgrade deliberately was going to expire. Gunn got re-upgraded in exchange for getting the sarcophaguus through customs. Wes may be siding with evil Fred in this; the rest of Team Angel may be very reluctant to fight Fred. Could the whole point of the takeover have been to try and keep Angel from being willing to fight the big bad they were creating? Their hands will be tied the whole time because they’re going to want to try to bring Fred back.
A also think we may se Lindsay again, only this time he’ll be siding with Angel against the Senior partners. But that’s just a guess.
I go more with PAD on this one. Been there, done that. Another cast member is now evil. (Angelus, Willow, Cordy …).
Yes, the writing and dialog were as sharp as ever and there were some great bits.(Astronauts, unless one of the Cavemen is a Lawyer)
But, I had a great sense of a Josh saying,
“What can I do now with “Character A” that will really be dramatic.”
I know this is common for writers, and I have usually appreciated the changing events in the Buffyverse, but one too many trips to the well.
BTW I did sort of think evil-Fred looked hot.
I don’t think the senior partners planned this. They could’ve found any number of other ways to get the package through customs, unless they just wanted to twist the knife that much harder into Gunn.
They need to shove this new uber/elder demon into the conduit and let it deal with the senior partners….
What is Angel’s team called anyway? Buffy had the Scoobies\Slayerettes, what about Wes, the late Fred, and Gunn called? The “Bosleys”? The Seraphim?
Nice way to leave the door open for a Spike spin-off, “You can go anywhere on Earth, be a roving troubleshooter, W&H’ll pick up the tab!”
re: Angel. Others have asked and attempted explanations for why Angel didn’t bring Fred with him to the Hole in the World. I think the best answer that ME could use to that question is that yes, it would have worked, and the reason they didn’t do it is because Wesley failed to properly use his “Big Book of Everything”. Given how Wesley’s skill with books previously led to his alienation from the others and set into motion their biggest threats, I think it would be ironically appropriate that his skills would this time have let him down when he needed them the most.
But that brings up the question:
Is this a possessed Fred, or is Fred dead and all that’s left is her body? The one preview for next week has Fred-zilla saying something along the lines of “You’ll do me this favor because of this body?” rather than directly appealing to Wes’ love of Fred the person…
Angel: I liked the episode mostly, but I too wondered why they didn’t take Fred with them to England.
The idea that the sarcophagus was held-up in customs was fairly ridiculous. The thing just vanished from the Hole in the World, yet we are supposed to accept that it reappeared on a ship or plane or something outside the US borders, instead of simply appearing where it was supposed to be? Come on! It gets stopped at the border, yet two vampires can fly internationally (presumably) without so much as a passport?
As one poster above mentioned, exactly what is to be gained by not calling the demon back to the Hole with the spell (killing thousands along the way), when they let one of the first demons be reincarnated to wreak no telling how much havoc and death?
I did however think punk-demon Fred looked very hot!
I don’t think they had a problem with customs incidentally – I think they manufactured the problem with customs specifically to drag Gunn into this. Everybody in Team Angel is going to have some specific and individual guilt in this by the end of it, I suspect – Gunn (customs), Wes (side with Fred), Angel (didn’t cast spell), with Spike and Lorne TBD. Fred will be both the least (directly) guilty and the most victimized by it.
What I expect is some “team breaks up, team realizes what’s important, team gets back together” bit in the remaining episodes, and that W & H will have ceased to exist by the end of the season.
As I reflect back on the Angel episode, I see that there are many subtle things that I missed on first reflection. Somebody mentioned on the “Astronauts vs Cavemen” thread that the whole arguement was a metaphor for Fred’s situation…which went right over my head.
Spike’s speech about a hole through the world. Will pointed out that he was trying to say ANTHING AT ALL that wasn’t “We’ve lost Fred” but I think his subconscious betrayed him and that’s exactly what he ended up saying. Fred’s loss is a hole through the world of Team Angel. Spike always surprises me with those deep thoughts of his. I always forget that he was a (terrible) poet before Dru found him.
Things that surprised others that didn’t surprise me:
(1) Wes shooting that guy. He’s already shown that he’d kill his own father in an instant if the guy threatened Fred. Kneecap-Boy is just lucky that Wes decided that he’d be a more useful lesson alive and screaming. I can see that this could be a sign of W&H’s coruption taking hold, but it is entirely unsurprising.
I found Lorne’s bit with Eve a little surprising, but not much. Lorne was simply telling Eve in no uncertain terms that they would do whatever it took…because that was how much they cared about Fred. Also, Eve might have been hoping that Lorne would be the Voice of Reason, holding back the others. He quickly dispelled that myth.
And I don’t see why Eve’s presence at Lindey’s apartment surprised me. She disappeared off the W&H radar…just like Lindsey had. It was so obvious that she was hiding in the one place designed specifically to be beyond the sight of the Senior Partners. Obvious, once I thought about it, but her being there surprised me.
Actually, it’s amazing how well the Team’s compromising of morals has been protrayed. Of all of them, Fred is the only one that I don’t really see having had to compromise much in the way of her morals…and her reward is to get eaten by an ancient demon. This causes the rest of the team to make further compromises to save her…Hmmm.
Angel
And wasn’t that a great line about Les Mis?
My favorite line was “Christmasland”
David
I don’t think the senior partners’ ultimate plan is to bring back the demon. I think, instead, it’s to corrupt Angel and the rest absolutely, but to make sure they know that they were responsible for their own corruption.
Gunn is the primary example. He was given his gift and took it voluntarily. He used it well and it became of value to him. When it left, he decided to do whatever was needed to get it back–just one little thing. That one little thing has now cost the life of one of his friends. He can’t blame the Senior Partners for anything other than giving him his implant in the first place. Everything else, he did by himself.
I think the two real consciences of the party are now gone. Cordelia gave it her best shot to set things right…it could have been a desperate attempt by the Powers That Be (if they aren’t the same as the Senior Partners…something that has been bugging me since last season). Now Fred and her innocence is gone. I think she was the last uncorrupted one and therefore the main target of the brute force attack.
Throughout the season, they’ve been bending their own rules about working with evil, and now they’re being called on it. They’ve started down the slippery slope, and now they’ve got to try to climb back up.
Fred’s dead.
The end result of the infestation was that her organs would ultimately liquify. You can’t survive something like that. Her body is now just a shell occupied by the demon.
The question is, will Team Angel be able to accept this, deep down? Or will they try to convince themselves that somehow, someway, Fred is still alive, a prisoner in her own body? Intellectually, they have to know this creature isn’t Fred; but emotionally, it could be hard for them to come to terms with that fact.
Without destroying story logic, the only possible way to bring back Fred would be to turn back time and prevent her from being infected in the first place. This isn’t a situation where Fred would be herself again be restoring her soul (Angel) or reaching out to her humanity (Willow).
Of course, if a spell was used to turn back time and change things, there would have to be a significant price to pay. The ethical question then becomes, do they defeat the demon (and go on with their lives), accepting that Fred is gone forever; or do they cast a spell to change what happened, knowing someone else will pay a price for that?
Personally, I think Team Angel will focus on the future, rather than try to change the past. Mainly because the only sacrifice the viewer would accept would be one (or more) of the remaining Team Angel members themselves. We’d no longer be able to identify with and root for these people if they let innocent strangers die (and we wouldn’t have any emotional investment in those stranger); and if some bad guys would have to die, it’s not really a sacrifice on the part of the good guys.
So, they’d have to sacrifice themselves. But if the major twist of the season is that Wesley (to use a hypothetical example) is going to die by the end so that Fred can live, it would have been more effective to such a sacrifice made in Wednesday’s episode than to pull it weeks from now at season’s end and say “gotcha!”
Since the solution of turning back time and sacrificing one or more of themselves (in general, not to the demon that killed Fred; that’d just take everyone back to square one) to keep Fred from being infected in the first place basically results in a cheap “gotcha” to the audience, the only remaining choice is that Fred remains irreversibly dead.
And frankly, I like it that way. I like the character just fine, but in shows like Buffy and Angel, where death can sometimes be a mere inconvenience, it’s important to show that in some cases (Joyce, Tara, Doyle and now Fred) death is absolutely final.
Rick
For Angel, he wasn’t considering the right options. It wasn’t “Do I save Fred but let 10,000 people die?” like he thought; it should have been “Do I cause the deaths of 10,000 people in order to stop a Great Old One from manifesting on Earth?” Saving Fred would have been a side benefit.
It will be interesting to see how this storyline contrasts with the Evil Willow story from Buffy season 6 and the Evil Cordy story from last season…
I guessed the “big secret” on THE WEST WING almost immediately. CJ’s a professional PR person, and as soon as she hears about Hoynes’ writing she turns ashen and behaves snappishly and aggressive towards everyone. As soon as they mentioned that Hoynes’ affairs would be in the book, I *knew* she’d be worried about being listed therein. I also believe Toby figured out the same thing, when he didn’t need to ask CJ what had her so worried.
I’m also getting sick of that annoying little Uberintern who keeps showing up Josh. We *get* that Josh should take him more seriously, alright? Now stop making Josh look incompetent to make this kid look good! It’s like Wesley Crusher in the White House.
I did laugh when they first said “bras,” with the union people deadly serious and Toby trying really hard to keep from laughing. That was nice.
Didn’t care much for the ANGEL episode. It had more than a few good moments and good lines, but it felt terribly rushed, and I thought Fred, esp., had some lines that were wildly out of character — the crack about the lacrosse team, for example. The whole thing reminded me of LOVE STORY, but with monsters.
I really like Fred’s folks, though. I’d watch a show built around their present-day versions.
Regarding next week’s West Wing: yeah, it’ll be interesting to see who gets accused of doing what to Ellie, but if the plot symopsis at http://westwing.bewarne.com/fifth/516eppur.html is right, the real reason to tune in seems to be that part of the episode will show Abby doing a PSA with Sesame Street’s Elmo and Big Bird…
I took Spike’s “hole in the world” speech to mean, “There’s something wrong here. We’re all becoming deeply corrupt. We should have noticed it before now.”
I should also add that I really, really liked this episode.
Rick said re Angel:
“Fred’s dead.
The end result of the infestation was that her organs would ultimately liquify. You can’t survive something like that. Her body is now just a shell occupied by the demon.”
Maybe I’m just cruising down that famous river Denial, but I think the organ issue can be worked around.
1. I seem to recall that when Willow brought Buffy back her corpse wasn’t looking too pretty. Unsurprising, given that it’d have been in the ground for about four months when Willow cast her spell. Plus we don’t know what sort of embalming process was used, and thus whether Buffy even had any internal organs at that point. But yet the resurrected Buffy clearly had a normal, working body throughout the rest of the series.
2. We only have the word of a doctor, who made a diagnosis before anyone knew what the nature of the parasite, that that’s what would happen to Fred’s internal organs. Personally, I’m thinking if it happened Fred’s dying would have been messier–particularly when her lungs went.
3. Speaking of which, it was pretty clear Illyria is using Fred’s body to speak in Fred’s voice–meaning air is being moved through Fred’s voicebox. I’m thinking you probably need lungs for that, meaning at least one internal organ is still there.
“Since the solution of turning back time and sacrificing one or more of themselves (in general, not to the demon that killed Fred; that’d just take everyone back to square one) to keep Fred from being infected in the first place basically results in a cheap “gotcha” to the audience, the only remaining choice is that Fred remains irreversibly dead.”
Um, actually, I think there’s more than those three options. For example, Fred could be playing possum in her own head, waiting for Illyria to give her an opening to take back her body–she has a history of using the way people tend to underestimate her against them (think Billyfied Wesley and Jasmine), and it would tie into a plotline in the book Wes read to her. That sort of scenario wouldn’t cheapen what we saw–just recast those events in a new light.
Anyway, like I said: I really don’t want her to be permanently gone. So I’d probably buy anything, even if it is cheap and stupid. 🙂
Or maybe his “you’d think he would have known” comment afterwards is him commenting on how suddenly they went from flippant and utterly certain of their eventualy victory, to the crashing defeat of the only way of saving Fred being to kill untold thousands…and neither solution can work because either choice is a crashing defeat. Oh, any maybe I’m thinking a little strangely, but my idea was to take Fred to the other side of the Hole in the World, and do it there, so Illyria can try and kill all the other proto-demons in the shaft on the way back…or let them all loose upon the Earth. I haven’t quite got which worked out yet. 🙂
Something that just occured to me bothers me. If these proto-demons are so bad, why didn’t the guardian do the spell anyway. It’s his job to keep them locked up, so why leave the decision up to Angel in the first place? I smell a rat. I dearly wish that I had recorded the episode of I could replay Mr. I-Cant-Lie’s lines for things he might have been evasive about.
I enjoyed Angel a vast amount, and only once I’m away from the glow that is Joss Whedon’s screenwriting skill, does the episode seem a little less than perfect. Still, it’s the best thing he’s done in the Buffyverse in ages, and it’s the first time I think he got all the Angel cast right.
The whole caveman vs. astronaut idea plays itself out everywhere, as the primitive confronts the civilized, as the caveman’s view of a world beyond his control faces the astronaut’s technological command of the world. Gunn facing his own dark self, and then bludgeoning Knox with a piece of lab equipment. WEs and Fred trying to turn back a prehistoric and savage demon with modern knowledge and science. The veneer of civilization returning to Wes in how he treats Gunn, and then slipping in how he deals with Fred’s illness. Even Lorne turning savage. And two creatures of the dark flying for the first time on an airplane, only to confront something ancient and deep and beyond modern man’s thought. A brilliant metaphor, and “the caveman wins.”
The only troubling aspect of this episode is that Angel has become unkind to women. Lilah, Darla, Cordy, probably Eve, and now maybe Fred all dying while the men go on. (The last male cast member to die was Doyle, and even minor male characters don’t seem to be dying of late.) If this were from anyone but the master of “girl power,” TV’s only bona fide feminist studies expert, I’d call is sexist. So what gives that Angel might be on the verge of losing its last female cast member? Has Joss lost control of the show to a pack of misogynists? is this balance for how many women there were on Buffy while poor Xander was left to bond with Clem?
I wonder if the cancellation of the show has provided a bit of accidental cover for Joss. Had the show not been cancelled, maybe a lot more fans would be all over him for this. Or maybe not. But the sizeable female audience for Buffy/Angel might be a bit concerned about now.
What the episode was building toward, and failed to deliver, was an Angel/Spike confrontation in which Angel is ready to make good on his intent to save Fred no matter what the cost, and Spike endeavors to stop him. What a climax that would have been, particularly if it had come down to a final battle atop that hole through the world.
A climax like that would’ve been great, specially if they fall and have to climb back up (through the stacks of coffins) while fighting each other.
However, such a scene would’ve been uncharacteristic for Spike as he has made no qualms about killing again, or letting people die (even those with souls like Principal Wood); nor is he seeking redemption for his past misdeeds (like Angel). Simply put, he wouldn’t care one way or the other.
I think the episode builts upon their sibling rivalry as opposed to a confrontation. Angel resents Spike for duplicating, imitating and replacing him; while Spike loves both besting and annoying Angel. Classic Big Brother – Little Brother scenario.
On the issue of trying to wrap things up fast; I remember reading in one of the Cordelia/100th Episode Interviews that the creators knew from the get go that the series was on shaky ground and wrote the season as if it were their last (this was probably done in the summer). As a result, Cordelia was brought back to do right by the fans and not to leave her subplot hanging. So, even though I feel that the series has been changing directions on me; I hope that it will all come together at the end. Because the way I see it, Lindsey’s whole reason for being is to fight Angel. If he had waited too long, then you would’ve had to justify Spike not being pìššëd too; which becomes a two on one scenario, which would probably end up with one of them just watching the other two fight.
Hopefully, Lindsey will be incorporated into “the big picture” and come back as an integrated part of the Senior Partners “plans”.
As for Smallville, I could say that Clark has one of those Universal blood types but I won’t. I’m getting annoyed/bored from the One Million and One uses for Kryptonite. Seriously, there are a million other ways the bad guys can gain powers. From Cosmic Rays to gamma bombs to radioactive spiders; it all doesn’t have to be about the Kryptonite. Next thing you know, they’ll be mixing Kryptonite with Bane’s Venom Serum. Oopps, too late.
Well, both Smallville & Angel were very emotional episodes for me. Just two weeks ago, my girlfriend had open-heart surgery. So, Clark’s concern for his father and Wesley’s for Fred hit me pretty close to home. That said, Smallville dissapointed me, in that the whole surgery thing was wwwwayyyy off. Let just put it this way: the only thing they got right was that it occured in a hospital. I did think that Clark’s superspeed burst at the end was cool. I agree that there’s no way that he could hear the shot, and also his “freeze time” superspeed only seems to kick in under extreme situations. Angel on the other hand, did everything right. The emotions were all dead on. Amy Acker & Alexis Dennisoff deserve Emmys for their work here imho. Wes exhibited exactly what I felt being at my lady love’s bedside. We even both read to our respective lovers. Made me cry like a baby, I tell ya. On a lighter note: do you think Fred will spell her name with two d’s now — ’cause she’s eeeevvviillll???
Echoing the above:
If Fred remains dead– I am truly heartbroken.
Her character was never developed as much as Cordy’s but this episode showed how much there was still left to learn.
When she asked, “Why do I have to go?” I started bawling like a 2 year old.
Anyone who has lost someone to a sudden illness or car accident– whatever– knows just how stunningly perfect the scenes between Fred and Wesley were written and how superbly they were played by these two fine actors.
ALEXIS DENISOF:
If the FOX “Powers That Be” don’t cast this man as Reed Richards in their upcoming “Fantastic Four” film– Then they REALLY should have their heads examined.
Alexis Denisof as Reed Richards? That is a good casting. He’s about the right age, has Reeds rugged good looks, and he can play a Brain. Neat idea
I don’t really seem to be in synch with the majority of comments on ANGEL this time out, since I thought the entire hour was badly conceived, overacted, overwritten, and over-directed–by the 20th time someone declaimed just how great Fred is (which I already knew), I was ready to kill her myself so we could all move on.
Honestly, WW and ANGEL (along with another former favorite, 24) have been so inconsistently enjoyable for all season that I’ve essentially given up thinking of these as shows I’d be sorry to miss. SMALLVILLE never consistently delivered for me in the first place, so, paradoxically, I’m able to enjoy it more when I bother to watch it.
I just want to put in a pitch for what I think is currently–and by far–the best show on network television: JOAN OF ARCADIA. Recognizable teens. The best, most nuanced portrayal of family life–and especially marriage–on TV in a long, long time. Writing, directing and acting that know when to push us, when to hold back–the show consistently has the guts to not go for emotional break points at every opportunity. PAD, I don’t know if you’re watching this, but, by God, man, you should be.
There’s only been one other point in my life when I assessed potential Friday night plans based on what was on TV–that was the first year or three of X-FILES. The shows are nothing alike, and I do end up catching JOAN on tape more often than not, but I’m always making sure that I’m able to set that tape up.
Peter, keep in mind they didn’t used Clark’s whole blood, just his platelets, which they used to make a serum. You can see that the serum is colorless, and we can presume that there was some synthesizing of stuff when making it, which is a bit more believable.
OTHER THOUGHTS:
In Velocity, they ripped off The Fast and the Furious. In Obsession, they did a Fatal Attraction. Now in this episode, they do a version of John Q.
Did anyone else notice that the name of the actor playing Garrett was James Kirk?
Interestingly, whereas Shawn Ashmore, who appeared as Eric Summers in Leech and Asylum, played Bobby Drake in X-Men, Kirk played Bobby’s brother Ronny, who called the cops on him and his friends in X2.
Clark tells Ben Powell to take him where he took Vince Davis’ body, and Powell complies. So Powell can just go flying off to wherever he wants without the knowledge or clearance by his superiors? How’d he do this? It would’ve made more sense for him to drive Clark there. It’s not like Powell owns the helicopter, does he?
NICE depiction of Clark’s superspeed when he steals the vial of the blood platelet formula from the lab right in front of Lex and Dr. Teng!! My mom didn’t even understand what had happened. Personally, I think this is a better depiction of the speed than the “blurry Clark” shtick, in part because we get to see things as those around Clark sees them. I also liked the “displaced air” effect when he uses his speed at the end to get rid of the bomb.
It wouldn’t work in real life, but it was COOL!
Okay, yet ANOTHER use for kryptonite! The list so far: It can used to give humans super powers, as a coating on bullets, in class rings, in snowglobes, and as a propulsion booster in cars. Now it can be used as an explosive! This stuff is the Smallville equivalent of anaprovaline in Star Trek! It has more uses than Arm & Hammer Baking Soda!
But when the hëll did Garrett have time to build a bomb, let alone one that used kryptonite? Why not make one with conventional materials? I mean, think about it: Is kryptonite really that much easier to find than diesel fuel and tropical fertilizer?
Okay, so Vince’s doctor injects Vince with a substance he doesn’t know, and without knowing how much to inject, and then when Garrett orders him to take Jonathan’s liver, the doctor tells Clark that he has no choice, even though Vince’s body will in all likely reject it? Also, he didn’t remove the air from the syringe before injecting it into Vince, which could’ve killed Vince with an embolism.
The sequence where Clark gets rid of the kryptobomb was EXCELLENT! My mom was particularly impressed that Clark ducked into the radiology lab to retrieve the radiology apron to shield him from the kryptonite in the bomb (I missed the sign on the lab door because I was saying something to her). Personally, I think Clark is REALLY lucky that there was a radiology lab right there where he and Garrett were, and not on a different floor, which meant he didn’t have to race around the hospital to look for it.
Still, it wouldn’t work. Garrett pressed the button on the detonator. This means Clark has to move faster than the speed of light to get to the bomb to that shed before it detonated. Even if he could do this, it would create a shockwave that would destroy the hospital and anyone he was close to when running this fast.
I don’t quite understand how I got the impression of such, but I thought that Angel, even though he said something to the equivalent of “Screw the world, I want my friend,” decided, in the end, to let Fred go. Now that I think back on it, was this actually in the trailer for next week’s episode?
Also, I think it’s pretty obvious that Fred is dead. That soul is gone, folks. Interesting that the transformation first manifested itself in transforming Fred’s (usually warm and sweet but now empty of life) big brown eyes into cold blue. (The blue demon look was keen.)
I never expected a big, knock-down fight between Angel and Spike. It would be stupid to have one at this point. I fully agree with previous posters that the Angel-Spike relationship is one akin to big brother-little brother. They’re moving beyond the knock-down fights, like siblings often do. For years you’d like to beat the crap out of your brother until you realize, that’s my brother. I’d die inside if he weren’t around. Angel and Spike are realizing how much they are to each other. They’re the only two like them on the face of the earth, just like my brother’s the only person on the face of the earth who shares my genes and grew up facing what we did. Sure they bicker over space men-cave men, but they both have the same ideas of right and wrong, if tainted.
I loved that moment where Spike holds out his hand to Angel when asked and says, after a beat, “Just like St. Petersburg,” and Angel responds, “I thought you’d forgotten.” They have a connection which is growing. It’s a wonderful character development. (Also love the Les Miz critique by Angel, espeically since I agree.)
I agree with a previous poster that Spike’s reflection on the hole through the world was his way of reflecting on the hole in their world created by Fred’s death. I always got the impression that William “the Bloody Awful Poet” could have improved with the proper instruction from a good writing teacher. Spike’s always been oddly observant of the world around him.
In all, while I had some problems with pacing on occasion (sometimes it just dra-g-g-e-d), I’m definitely looking forward to Joss Whedon’s eventual commentary on the DVD. The repetitions, the comments by different characters, the display of different aspects of each from what we’re used to seeing, were effective for me.
But the worst was seeing Fred, of whom I’ve become very fond this season, going through the possession. Her illness, the strange outbursts, the outrage that she was being taken down, reminded me very much of loved ones who have tried to fight cancer only to be defeated. “Why me, dammit?” they say. And I agree with them. And her battle made perfect sense to me.
That sequence of Fred’s picking up “You Are My Sunshine” from Lorne, then Lorne looking back at her in shock and the cut to the blood drops hitting Wesley’s face blew me away. How perfect that it was that song. How wrenching the expression of shock and horror on poor Lorne’s face was. I actually played it over a couple of times before I let the show continue on my DVR. Brilliantly done.
***A-
In the early Superman story recently reprinted in “World’s Best Comics,” Clark gave Lois a transfusion of his blood, and that instantly restored her to health. So, that particular property of Clark’s blood was established by Jerry Siegel himself.
As far as the “Smallville” episode, I wondered why Clark didn’t use his heat vision to melt the detonator, or at least heat it up enough so that Garrett dropped it. Also, I was surprised they didn’t go with the ironic-yet-cliched ending in which it would have been explained that Garrett’s liver was used to save his brother.
I thought this Angel episode was fantastic, and in general I’ve been blown away by this season. I don’t think it’s a case of the season being “yanked in one direction and then another.” I think it’s more an example of the kind of twists and turns that Joss has always liked to put into his shows, like Adam killing his creator midway through Buffy season 4.
First off Caveman.
I as a person of the now ‘Astronaut’ would easily be killed by a savage ruthless caveman. I couldn’t stand up to that kind of raw agression. These are ancient things that lived in a harsh world where killing was an everyday way of life. They were built for survival, we are built for channel surfing. If you go with the civil versus primal meaning of astro and caveman, again caveman would win. Every person when faced with a life or death situation usually devolves into something with only its survival at the front.
On another topic, could we be getting hints of a third spin off show?
Spike international vampire of mystery.
Travels the world fights evil…I’m just grasping at straws, but I think it could work.
I need me some Joss TV on the air!
Hëll I think I’d watch Andrew’s Slayers if they pitched it.