When the early photos from the revival of “Doctor Who” were released, fan pronouncements were dire. Most of it centered around his clothing, which didn’t look vaguely Victorian or quaint. And British fans, according to SFX magazine, dismissed Billie Piper as “a has-been teen popstrel.”
Well, we just got done watching all 13 episodes of the first season, and boy, did it kick ášš. (Yes, we got unauthorized DVDs. We do that on occasion when it’s something we reeeeally want to see. However, if it shows up in authorized version, we always buy it so the producers get our money.)
What is it about fans, anyway, that there’s always so much nay-saying and prejudging? In TV shows, in comics. This incredible urge to greet any word of change or trying something different with a resounding, “It’s gonna suck.” You’d think that they’d eventually learn to way and see the final product, but no. No, every time something different is done it’s “They’re changing it, it’s going to be terrible.”
Sheesh.
PAD
• 
“Those would be the Autons controlling the mannequins, and it’s from the first episode, ‘Rose’.”
Thanks, Craig. It was reviewed favorably in the Seattle P-I, which is why I watched it. However, ever since Comcast moved CBUT to channel 99, it’s all I can do to remember where the goddam thing is. I recall reading in the self-same review that this was going to be the only season with this particular actor as Dr. Who, as he didn’t like the part? Is that correct?
“I recall reading in the self-same review that this was going to be the only season with this particular actor as Dr. Who, as he didn’t like the part? Is that correct?”
Christopher Eccleston did do just the one season as the Doctor, but I never got any indication he didn’t like the part from watching the intros he did for the CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Company) broadcasts. Maybe he was _acting_ in those promos, too, but he seemed genuinely enthusiastic about having been a part of the series.
About the time the second episode aired, someone at the BBC put out a statement, attributed to Eccleston, that he’d decided to leave because of fear of typecasting. As it later turned out, A) this statement was released without Eccleston’s O.K., B) (as I understand it) that everyone involved had known Eccleston would only be doing one year before filming had even begun; and C) (as I understand it) his departure was supposed to be a surprise, so that the end of the season regeneration would also be a surprise.
_Why_ Eccleston intended to only do one year, I have no idea (assuming the idea originated with him and not Producer Russell T. Davies). But again, his CBC intros seemed to show a man enthusiastic about the series.
Rick
P.S. It’s curious, the character’s name is _The Doctor_. It’s the _show_ that’s called _Doctor Who_. Yet for the first 17 seasons of the original series, and the first season of the new series, the end credits list the applicable actor as playing “Doctor Who.” I’ve never understood that. With the exception of one episode during the Hartnell era (“The War Machines”) he’s never referred to as “Doctor Who” in the whole history of the series. So why identify the character as such in the credits?
And no, asking “Doctor Who?” as a question, such as, “Hello, I’m the Doctor.” “Doctor? Doctor Who?” doesn’t count.
For the record, it was the Doctor himself, in the first episode, “An Unearthly Child”, who first used the phrase. Ian Chesterton, assuming the Doctor’s surname was Foreman, addressed him as Dr. Foreman.
“Who?” The Doctor muttered. “Doctor Who? What’s he talking about?”
Who fans who’ve been put off by the outcry at Outpost Gallifrey would do well to check out
http://unitnews.co.uk/
it’s a much more congenial forum for Who fandom and pretty much everyone there adores the new series (and well they should, it’s been terrific so far).
just don’t mention any “unofficial” copies there or you’ll be banned post-haste.
i’d also highly recommend the Big Finish audio adventures.
to quote Gary Russell, a script editor for the Big Finish audios, “A small but powerful bit of fandom is really run by a bunch of tossers.”
-will
I second the recommendation for the Big Finish Production cds. At least some of them. I love the Colin Baker audio adventures including THE HOLY TERROR which is written by Robert Shearman, the same writer of DALEK from last year’s series. THE HOLY TERROR pulls off an audio adventure with the Sixth Doctor and his comic strip companion, Frobisher, the shape changing penguin.
And no, asking “Doctor Who?” as a question, such as, “Hello, I’m the Doctor.” “Doctor? Doctor Who?” doesn’t count.
And yet, that seems to be the way the show got it’s name. 🙂
“Those would be the Autons controlling the mannequins”
Well, actually the Autons would BE the mannequins, controlled by the Nestene.
My post vanished so lets see if I can remember any of it…
BBCA is actually wholely owned by BBC Worldwide. It is distributed by Discover networks, but they don’t own any of it. BBCWW and DCI do co-own Animal Planet, so there’s all sorts of cooperation between the two companies. (I mention this because I see this misinfo showing up in a number of “Why doesn’t BBCA show the new Doctor Who).
http://www.bbcworldwide.com/aboutus/corpinfo/annualreps/review2005/bus_channels_03.htm
re: The “New” Doctor Who
It was really not much more than when Peter Davison took over for Tom Baker..just a new Doctor…I did find it a bit funny about Billie being cast, as I do know her as a teen pop star (I have one of her albums–hey, I liked “Honey to the Bee” first time I heard it. Then I got the album..and heard it a second timel…boy, was that a waste of a bmg purchase), but really, it was more like “She still has a career? Who knew?”
But the “New” Doctor who is still the same at the core. It’s about one or two persons, making a difference. Despite all of the trappings, it’s about someone standing up and making the world a better place.
BSG – I imagine BSG is used instead of BG because people like 3or more initials. initials. Peter David is PAD. TNG, DS9, VGR, LSH..And “battlestar” is a made up word–so it’s 2 words stuck togehter.
“New” BSG – I was very much a wait and see about the new BSG. I was leary about the changes I’d heard about, but was in a “Spider-Man the movie is not Spider-Man the comic” mind frame about it. I was fine, til the miniseries put me into a coma stretching maybe a 2 hour story into a 2 day snooze fest.
While the new BSG uses the story of the original, it’s ignored the themes. The original, is about hope. Their world is lost, but they strive for their paradise. In the new one, that quest is a lie. Adama doesn’t belive in Earth..he lies to the people. In the original, Zac dies a hero, sacrificing himself so Starbuck and Apollo might be able to warn people of the Cylon attack. In the new one, he dies because he’s an incompentent who got where he was by sleeping with his teacher.
The best part of the new one was the trapped on Kobal part, with characters who for the most part weren’t from the old series, trying to survive against overwhelming, but not unbeatable, odds. It was compelling. In space, the only reason the humans survive is because the Cylons have a plan..oh yes, they have a plan. Really..I’ve seen the blue prints..fantastic. (I think the plan is to get as many seasons made as they can). They are so overwhelming it makes no sense for the Galactica to survive. There’s still replicants..I mean human cylons onboard, yet none just blow the place up.
OTHER-for real? this half/half thing mentioned in the spoilers? Oi! With that and the all but guaranteed upcoming divorce/widowing/erasing of Mary Jane, why am I interested in reading Spider-Man again?
Andy Ihnatko – one of the best tech collumnists around! Just saying is all.
Rich
“Son of Man” was the 60s Dennis Potter play that caused a big uproar at the time.
Rob
Also following on Rich’s recommendations, I would think “The League of Gentlemen” would appeal to someone with a very dark sense of humour after a VERY unique Britishness.
But be warned the film is awful and it is as if it was made by someone else. Worse than the transition to film of the British sitcoms of the 70s! I didn’t think that was possible.
Mind, my viewing of the film was also impaired by the group of 10 year olds (yes, they were let in to see it despite the certificate) who guffawed at stuff that wasn’t even intended to be funny! Worse than canned laughter!
Rob
BSG is also part of the logo of the show in the main titles and can be seen in patches on the jackets of the crew.
“And “battlestar” is a made up word–so it’s 2 words stuck togehter.”
Aren’t they all?
I had this discussion with my boss at work a few weeks ago. He mentioned that Kwanzaa (sp?) is a “made-up holiday”. I asked him- aren’t they all?
League of Gentlemen..Was alan Moore’s series a play on that title, or just a coincidence?
I think the League of Gentlemen/LXG (don’t really like that abbreviation and I feel Mr Moore probably feels the same way!) was a probably a coincidence – both may relate to the 1960 Ian Carmichael film of the John Boland novel.
Both the initial publication of LXG and the League’s transfer to TV from radio were in 1999, so their initial genesis in Alan Moore’s mind and the Edinburgh Festival respectively may have been at the same time a few years previously.
Rob
Oops! Not Ian Carmichael – was getting mixed up with School for Scoundrels for some reason – it starred Jack Hawkins (Just checked!)
Rob
I don’t recall Troughton ever flipping a coin, but perhaps you’ve seen episodes I haven’t. When I first saw _Doctor Who_ in the mid 1980s, there were only five Troughton episodes known to exist. Since then, at least one believed lost- “Tomb of the Cybermen-” has been found and released on DVD.
I think there were always more than that. I remember that the BBC aired 2 separate 4 episode stories in the mid 1980’s. Mind Robber and something else.
He mentioned that Kwanzaa (sp?) is a “made-up holiday”. I asked him- aren’t they all?
Well yes, but most aren’t made up by a single individual within living memory.
700 years and still handing out ‘What the Hëll is Kwanza?’
Well, I’ll bite. I looked forward to the new Dr. Who, wasn’t dismayed by Eccleston’s modern dress sense, liked the acting (even by Billie Piper), and generally found the show to be mostly crap. Not because they’re “different,” or because I Fear Change, but because a lot of them were just poorly written.
Oh, there were some great episodes. “Dalek” was great, and so was the two-parter set during the blitz, and “The Unquiet Dead” – the one with Charles Dickens – was the standout. But with the exception of “The End of the World”, all of Russell T. Davies’s scripts were plagued by an inability to balance character development with plot, a painfully hamfisted approach to satire, and a surprising preponderence of toilet humor (the rubber fart monsters got real old real fast).
And the last episode – dear god. The first series ended with one of the most stultifyingly goofy arc resolutions I’ve ever seen in television (you’re using your omnipotence to send yourself a message through time and space, and THAT’S the most direct one you can think of? what happened to frigging telegrams?), a massively anticlimactic deus ex machina, and a death/regeneration scene so awkwardly prolonged it became unintentionally hilarious (think Monty Python and “I’m not dead yet!”).
So please don’t assume that I’m down on the new Who because I’m an anal retentive fan who just can’t handle changes to his precious childhood memories. I just don’t like crap writing.
Re: Eccleston’s departure from the role
There’s a lot of varying reports on this, in no small part due to the unauthorized press release the BBC sent out; however, AIUI, the season finale was slightly reshot once Tennant was cast, which scotches the idea that it was always planned that way. (IIRC, the ending was originally written to leave the Doctor’s fate ambiguous, so as to leave the season on a cliff-hanger; however, they had ample warning that Eccleston was departing, and so re-wrote it to be an unambiguous regeneration sequence.)
Without saying anything more, I provide two significant facts: 1) The series did not get an American release or distribution, which they had factored in for in their budget. 2) David Tennant, the Tenth Doctor, is making about half what Chris Eccleston did.
Make of these things what you will. 🙂
I’m probably coming into this discussion very late having just returned from London, so forgive any major lapses in grammar due to a combination of jet lag and having the back of my airline seat kicked for eight hours by a kid with ADD.
I couldn’t help chiming in here, because the subject of Doctor Who fandom kept cropping up over the holidays, not from a lack of a life but because my wife is working on the series and was on her two week Christmas break from it while I was over there. I’m not all that sure that Sheelagh wanted to spend her down time talking about Doctor Who, but when you’re working on a long-running series, it tends to bleed through into every moment of your working life, as I’m sure Peter will attest.
The aforementioned Gary Russell quote sums up my feeling about fandom in general, where I think the outspoken annoying fans are far outnumbered by the normal fans who just enjoy seeing new episodes of their favorite series. And of course there are the small number of real losers who basically give fans a bad name. Like the people who showed up during location filming this season armed with laser pointers that they used to disrupt the night’s filming until security escorted them out. Or another night when the production was driving away from the location until to see fans turning over garbage fans in their wake, hoping to find old call sheets or other documentation left behind. If one fan like that can tarnish the reputation of a hundred relatively normal, well-adjusted fans, I have no doubt that one unhappy and outspoken person can eclipse the voices of a silent but happy majority.
In the interest of full disclosure, I should point out that I actually got my start as a so-called journalist interviewing Doctor Who people nearly 20 years ago. My very first professional sale was the official Doctor Who Magazine, for which I interviewed the late Dalek creator Terry Nation, and I still have a photo copy of that check, embossed with figures of Spider-Man and the Hulk (the magazine was originally published by Marvel UK). And anybody who was unsure of my fan origins need only find the ceramic TARDIS bank hidden away in the bedroom or the rubber Vervoid head sitting over my desk right now, which was rescued from a BBC dumpster several years ago when the makeup department was being dismantled.
I mention all of this to show that even though I now make a living in this ridiculous business, there’s still a small part of me that is still a fan. It’s the part of me that cheered back in March at the launch for the new series when the opening titles came up for the first time, or the part of me that got goosebumps at a screening at the press screening of The Christmas Invasion when they showed clips of the Cybermen and Sarah Jane Smith. Okay, I also cheered when Sheelagh’s name came up in the credits too, but that’s just being a good husband.
But more importantly, Russell T. Davies the current producer is a Doctor Who fan, and there’s absolutely no doubt in my mind that he loves the series. He’s also a tremendously clever writer, who understood that Doctor Who had to change with the times, and that meant having to make some changes that were sometimes unpopular. Does that make him any less a fan? Considering he managed to bring the series back as well as making it a huge success, I think the answer is absolutely not. And incidentally, David Tennant is a huge Doctor Who fan as well. He may be playing it very cool in recent interviews, but ask him about his first day of filming, when he got congratulatory letters from Tom Baker and Peter Davison and you’ll know what a big fan of the series he is.
Just to address a couple of points made by previous posters, I believe the BBC was hoping for a much bigger sale in America than BBC America. I’m not entirely sure of this, but there were rumors that the Beeb was originally going to tie sales of the new series to a huge package of early episodes, which would certainly have been enough to scare off potential buyers if that was indeed true. I would imagine they’ll have a much easier time this summer, when they’ll have 26 episodes plus a Christmas special, which would make a much more attractive package. In the meantime, the BBC must have realized that it didn’t make sense to release the Region 1 DVDs in Canada and not in America, so thank goodness for small favors.
Regarding Eccleston’s sudden departure, I don’t think anybody realized he was going to leave so soon, Eccleston included. I think the demanding schedule of extremely long shooting days as well as six-day weeks proved to be too much, as well as a few major family problems that cropped up during filming. By all accounts, Tennant is having an easier time of it, but the demands of production have not gotten any easier this season.
Finally, if there are any Billie Piper nay-sayers still out there, I think they will finally be silenced this season. I think Billie did a superb job in The Christmas Invasion (in which Tennant’s Doctor is essentially off-stage for the first half), and there’s even better stuff to come, I promise.
I’m not entirely sure of this, but there were rumors that the Beeb was originally going to tie sales of the new series to a huge package of early episodes, which would certainly have been enough to scare off potential buyers if that was indeed true.
This seems to be the case.
When it was announced that the BBC was trying to get a US station to pick up the series, it seemed to be either stated or implied from the start that, with the new series, the station had to buy the old as well.
Which is why there are now only two PBS stations airing the old series here in the States – the BBC would not renew contracts with the individual stations. When the last two contracts (Iowa Public Television and Maryland Public Television) expire, that’s the end of the old Who series in the US.
First time on this forum having followed a link from the Outpost Gallifrey site.
We all think that PAD would be a great writer for the new Who.
As regards Ecclestons departure. It wasn’t planned from the start and a lot of production people and BBC big wigs are seriously annoyed with Christopher Ecclestons decision.
Ultimately since his departure he has given the impression that he did not like playing the Doctor from the word go. “Quotes” have suggested that Ecclestons thinks that family TV is beneath him. Also he found all his promotional duties were a tasteless and dull part of his contract.
Iron Lungfish: I generaly disagree with you regarding the series…I really liked it, but I do agree on 2 parts, the farting aliens did get old fast, and I was dissapointed by the anti-climax of the “Bad Wolf” reveal. After the build up and the websites and all…feh.
Think comics/SF/TV fans are pessimistic about remakes/revivals/reimaginings? Google “2006 Dodge Charger” and see what kind of reception it got from enthusiasts because it has four doors, because it doesn’t look like the 1999 concept car, because it doesn’t come with a manual transmission, because it doesn’t look exactly like the 1968-70 version, because it doesn’t cost under $20,000…it’ll make the Dr. Who naysayers look positively ecstatic.
Paul
“As regards Ecclestons departure. It wasn’t planned from the start and a lot of production people and BBC big wigs are seriously annoyed with Christopher Ecclestons decision.
“Ultimately since his departure he has given the impression that he did not like playing the Doctor from the word go. “Quotes” have suggested that Ecclestons thinks that family TV is beneath him. Also he found all his promotional duties were a tasteless and dull part of his contract.”
Which is weird, if these quotes are accurate, given that when his name was announced (based on press reports I read at the time), he seemed enthusiastic about the part.
I don’t know much about Eccleston’s past work, only that I recognized him from _The Others_. If he’s been in other films I might have seen, neither his name or face jogged any memories of them.
Whether Eccleston’s short tenure was known from the get-go, and whatever the reasons for his relatively quick departure, I enjoyed his season as the Doctor. If he left the production team and the BBC in the lurch, presumably breaking his contract in doing so, then he deserves criticism for unprofessional behavior. On the other hand, if the news of a planned departure was prematurely leaked by those who should have known better, then that same criticism should fall on his/her/their shoulders.
Rick
Apologies if this ends up posting multiple times. I had initial connection errors, but that doesn’t mean previous attempts aren’t floating around in cyberspace
“I was dissapointed by the anti-climax of the “Bad Wolf” reveal. After the build up and the websites and all…feh.”
SPOILERS for Bad Wolf reveal
In the recently-released, _Doctor Who, the Shooting Scripts_ Russell T. Davies wrote that very early on, he knew that Rose would end up becoming the “Time Goddess”, as he put it; so there wasn’t a last minute change from some other planned character.
My own theory was that it would turn out to be The Master, though I have to admit I missed most of the Bad Wolf references the first time around (the CBC re-ran the season over the summer, actually starting before the initial run had ended). The first time, I’d missed the penultimate episode, “Bad Wolf”, entirely; so when I saw it the second time, and the teaser for “The Parting of the Ways” had an off screen voice say, “they (the Daleks) survived through me”, my first thought was that voice would A) be Bad Wolf, and B) be the Master.
But I didn’t have any trouble with it being Rose.
Davies also admitted that he didn’t initially tell the crew what the words “Bad Wolf” spray painted on the TARDIS meant, in case his idea turned out to fall flat. He found, however, that, without really knowing what “Bad Wolf” meant- or if it meant anything- crew members were finding ways to slip those two words into other episodes, suggesting things like the German version of the term on the bomb in “The Doctor Dances.” Davies said he found that aspect somewhat Bad Wolfish in and of itself.
I’m paraphrasing, since I don’t have the book in front of me, but I can provide a direct quote if there’s a hue and cry for one.
Rick
Just to follow up on a couple of recent posts re Ecleston’s departure, I was at the BBC’s press launch for the New Who back in March I think, at which Eccleston addressed a couple of hundred journalists about the series. In hindsight, it’s interesting to look at his comments considering at that point- before the first episode had even aired- he already knew he was leaving!
to be fair, my comments on Outpost Gallifrey were based on some ridiculous reviews i read there. the sort of thing that gives SF fans a bad name.
however, i’ve subsequently joined the forum itself, and while there’s a small handful of unreasonable people, overall it seems to be a very good group.
-will
“Whether Eccleston’s short tenure was known from the get-go, and whatever the reasons for his relatively quick departure, I enjoyed his season as the Doctor. If he left the production team and the BBC in the lurch, presumably breaking his contract in doing so, then he deserves criticism for unprofessional behavior. On the other hand, if the news of a planned departure was prematurely leaked by those who should have known better, then that same criticism should fall on his/her/their shoulders.”
The rumour is that Eccleston was always only going to do one series (which is how they got an actor of his stature in the UK in the first place) with a surprise regeneration at the end of the series. However, after the massive success of the first episode (critically, and viewing figure-wise) Eccleston got drunk with a Mirror journalist and leaked that he was leaving.
Such a shame. If that had been pulled off, people would have been talking about it for years.
Re: Eccleston’s departure.
It’s been confirmed in a couple of sources (most notably DWM) that Eccleston met with the producers to tell them he wouldn’t be returning just before Christmas 2004. This was during the filming of the Empty Child episode. No reshoots of the final scenes of PotW were required, although they did film alternate versions (including one where Rose dies) in order to put the tabloids off the scent.
RTD and others have implied, however, that Eccleston had told them prior to being cast that he would *probably* only do one season so they weren’t completely unprepared.
RE: League of Gentlemen
There can actually be some confusion. “The League of Gentlemen” is a 1950s crime caper were ex-soldiers from the British Army conspire to rob a bank. “The League of EXTRAORDINARY Gentlemen” is the Alan Moore comic book and terrible movie about victorian superheroes.
“The League of Gentlemen” is also the name of a group of comedians/actors who were fans of the 1950s movie. When they moved from the stage to get their own BBC TV show, the series was called The League of Gentlemen as well. Finally, they made a movie called “The League of Gentlemen’s Apocolypse”.
Which is all pretty confusing, really.
Just posted on Aintitcool.com:
http://www.aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=22185
BBC’s New DOCTOR WHO
Coming To SciFi In March!!
…The channel will begin transmitting all 13 regular 2005 episodes at 9 p.m. Fridays, beginning March 17.
As a result, the U.S. DVD release of the season, originally slated for Valentine’s Day, will now bow on July 4.
Since most of the people here seem to be so in love with Doctor Who, what would be a good DVD or book to start with for someone who’s never seen anything to do with the show before?
Go in straight with the new series. The DVDs for New Doctor Who were put out individually before being collected with extras, so the original ones are cheap on eBay. Volume 1 with Rose and The Unquiet Dead are a great start.
Eccleston’s departure has been spun. It was always intended for whoever played the Doctor to last one season, so RTD could do a regeneration story for a new audience.
Oh and the season finale was not reshot. The “reshoot” was the piece they did for Comic Relief, which shows Rose’s initail reaction to the Tenth Doctor.
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