For the startling number of people here who post under their own names. Who make the same choice that I routinely make wherever I put my thoughts out there, be it here, other websites, or in print: to attach my name to my opinions. To not hide behind the comfort of anonymity. Even though this course of action has subjected me to: people trying to get me fired from Marvel; people trying to get me fired from DC; attempts at boycotts; my name showing up on blacklists; people challenging me to debates; people writing and publishing diatribes based upon things I never said; people shouting at me at conventions; people showing up at store signings and hurling a steady stream of abuse; and much more.
Screw ’em.
For me, living in a free society isn’t always a comfortable thing, and that’s the part we should appreciate–and often don’t. Just ask all the would-be censors who want certain books, certain comic books, certain TV shows, certain movies, to just go away or, even better, be driven away through means ranging from organized boycotts to legal prosecution. They’re all in favor of free speech, as long as it’s within their comfort zone. Why would anyone want to share any traits, on any level, with people like that? Lack of comfort is what you should be willing to deal with. That’s the price of a free society.
I’m always reminded that in 1776, a bunch of rich white guys signed their names to a piece of paper telling the king to sod off, knowing that it could cost them their property, their freedom, their lives, their sacred honor. And here we are, 250 years later, and we’re afraid to sign our names to our opinions because we don’t wanna get spammed or trolled?
I totally understand the attraction of anonymity. I can’t say, though, as I think it’s helped rational discourse in this country. I always flash back to that Disney cartoon with Goofy as a driver. He’s perfectly calm and rational and polite until he gets behind the wheel and he becomes an anonymous guy in a car…and then goes totally mental. I think the information superhighway is loaded with guys who wind up turning into outraged Goofys. I see discussion boards where people almost uniformly post under fake names, but it doesn’t come across like discussion. You know what it reads like? Road rage.
So fine. I choose to drive with the top down so people know who’s behind the wheel.
Others are, of course, welcome to do as they wish. Free society, after all.
PAD
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*Blush*
What’s this about, Ruben?
Just a reflective reaction…You see, I have PDD-NOS. Image one of those boards archers use for practice. Classic autism is the yellow bit in the center. They you have the red ring (people with autism-like disorders), the blue ring (PDD-NOS) and finally the black ring (average Joe). Anyway, because of my issues, I’m not that good with taking complements. (Even a general one like this.) Really, when my boss says something positive about me…well, my first instinct is to dive under the table.
Added to that….I’ve written a trilogy of Trek books…but I’m still working up the courage to send them in. But I’m sorta worried they’ll tick off Mr David. So to get a compliment from somebody who you half-worship/half scares to you death is really weird.
At this risk of making you a bit more uncomfortable, thanks for sharing, and good luck with the books!
Well, that’s what I mean. I sensed from your reaction that Peter was talking about you. That’s why I asked Peter below if there was incident that provides an explanatory context for the blog post, and your reaction. Can you fill us in? Or is it too private?
No one thing prompted it. It’s just a reaction to some of the places I’ve been and things I’ve seen.
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Look: fifteen years ago, “Name Withheld” first appeared in the pages of CBG, slamming various pros. And he was roundly condemned because the general feeling was that to slam others while cloaked in anonymity was the mark of a coward. Yet now anonymity has become the norm. So were the sentiments back then misplaced? Or has something simply gone wrong? I lean toward the latter.
PAD
From now on when I’m arguing with “Riotgrrrrl#127” I will have that image of Goofy in my head.
This reminds me of John Gabriel’s Greater Internet Dickwad Theory (which I have the t-shirt of) that goes: normal person + anonyminity + audience = total dickwad. I don’t think any of us have to look far online to find examples of this (though it may be hard to believe some of the trolls and bile-spewing wannabe pundits are normal people offline).
I find it sad that while being anonymous has its place (in polling, AA, etc.), so many people online take it as a license to throw out the basics of manners, decorum, logic, and even facts to simply attack and rant on whatever they want. I don’t think of the Internet as corrupting (like some critics) but more of a neutral tool, to be used for good or ill by the folks online. And it seems like for so many it’s become a shield for the worst elements of human nature.
I like that PAD has posters put and verify their names before posting. While discussions can become arguments and even flame wars, at least the folks are putting their names (or aliases) to stand behind instead of just striking from the shadows, as it were.
It’s actually the Greater Internet Fûçkwád Theory (aka, GIFT).
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(I’ve been going by the handle “Sasha” since the days of Usenet — it’s practically second nature to identify myself thusly online. But for those who don’t remember my actual name when I listed it in my contribution from two years and 2 days ago, it’s David Tumarkin.)
I think both versions are out there. My t-shirt says “Dickwad,” possibly so it can be worn without people giving the wearer grief for having the f-word displayed on a garment in public.
(Then again, I got no complaints and several compliments for doing the NYC AIDS Walk while wearing a Goats t-shirt that read “My killer robot škûll-fûçkëd your honor student.” I miss NY…)
Hmm, I feel like something specific prompted this, but I don’t know what (haven’t been reading all of the comment threads).
This makes me think of the West Wing episode when people were giving the Republican Lawyer Ainsley Hayes a hard time and gave her dead flowers and wrote an ugly word on it. Sam Seaborn say that he signs his name on his work and writes – “Your fired – S. Seaborn.’ And of course we have Herm Edwards quote – “Put your name on it!”
For what it is worth, I’ve never thought to not use my name. Of course I think before I post.
Many years ago there was a TV PSA that said “How would we act if we all signed our work?”, showing things like a pushcart vendor proudly sticking a little sign that said “Hotdog by Ron Schmits” (or whatever).
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At the end we saw three people sitting, back to the camera in director’s chairs that said like “Jim Smith – Writer”, Jane Doe – Producer” and “Frank Jones – Director” … and then they all turned round in the chairs to look at the camera over their shoulders and smile in a shy way, like “Was this a good spot that I helped make?”
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My mother, who was an advertising copywriter, producer, director, etc. over most of her working life, absolutely loved that ending.
I don’t think it was that many years ago — I’m pretty sure I remember seeing that ad! (At a minimum, I remember reading someone else describe it, but I think I’ve actually seen it.)
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Agreed — a great piece.
Quite possibly you’re remembering me describing it – i have a couple of times.
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I’m pretty sure (from the context i remember it in) that it was forty or more years ago; either before i left for the Navy (1967) or shortly after i got back (1972 – 76).
That could be, particularly if you’ve described it before here or on the Pibgorn forum (where I lurk).
A little over 10 years ago I decided to always sign my real name to every post I make on every blog, site, etc…. I visit. For the simple reason, if I’m going to take the time to write and join a conversation, then why shouldn’t I stand behind my words with my real name? If I use some phony name (IMO) then I must not have strong convictions in what I have to say.
And if I don’t have those convictions, why should I expect those who read it to give it any validity?
Besides, if I sign my name and link to my site, I might actually get some traffic to read my daily web comic. 🙂
For much the same reasons you give, I’ve always used my own name when commenting on blogs. (Only exception would be some ages ago on CompuServe. But I was younger and it was a mutually supportive Comic Book fan group where great differences of opinion didn’t exist.)
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I figure, if I’m going to have the courage of my convictions, I’m going to have to put my name to them. And if I’m not willing to sign my real name, then I really am not proud of what I’m saying. A time or two I’ve been tempted to use an alias for some particular comment. That’s when I know I’m about to be an ášš and stop myself.
As someone who has used online aliases in the past, I can attest to the ultimately fruitless and unsatisfying experience of having one. So as I sit here today, I am in total agreement with Peter on his major thread point here.
Mr. David,
You sir kick ášš and are allways out of bubblegum! Keep it up it telling it like it is. The truth is the ugly 800 lb gorilla and it shall set you free even if you dont like it! LOL
I think you mean the Elephant in the Room, a metaphor for a truth that people ignore.
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The 800 lb. gorilla, by contrast, is the overly dominant participant or element in a system, which if you think about it, is pretty much the opposite of the truth, since the truth is often unpopular. This is why I tend to favor the school hierarchy metaphor that the Truth is the wallflower or a.v. science nerd sitting up against the wall at the school prom, whereas the Lie is the Jock Prom King or Prom Queen. The former is the correct, right and often virtuous commodity, though unpopular.
Hey it worked. I just checked out your daily web comic. Fun stuff!
That was supposed to be a comment to Richard J. Marcej above. Computer suck!
Thanks! :b
Sometimes I use my real name online, sometimes I use an alias. If I wrote my full last name here, it would be pretty obvious that my alias is probably a better guarantee of who’s really “me” than my first and last name are. It may not make the connection between the “me” online and the “me” offline if you don’t know me at least well enough to have my personal e-mail address, but since there are at least three people with the same name as me in my city and I’ve never seen anybody else use the same regular online alias that I do when I choose to use one, well….
But common names vs unusual aliases aren’t really what I wanted to post about. I wanted to post about the reason why I use one at all; I grew up online. No, I’m not as crazily young as you might think when I first say that, I’m just counting since Prodigy in the early ’90s when I was a kid. And so I spent about a decade as a minor online hearing that I should never use my real name. They don’t tell the kids (or at least didn’t when I was one of them) not to use their real names until they’re 18, or not to use them until they finish high school, they told us not to use our real names. So I didn’t. I came up with a unique alias and used it for everything.
Now I’m an adult and have been for quite some time, and in some places I use my real first name and last initial online, and I’m on Facebook under my real name. But I didn’t stop using my alias for everything, either. For one thing on websites where I have to create a username, it’s a heck of a lot easier than trying to come up with something based on my incredibly common real name that isn’t taken yet. I’m also still involved in some of the fan communities that I first joined in high school or just out of it, and it seems pointless to change the name that everybody knows me by there.
Hiding under an alias because you’re afraid of being spammed or trolled does sound cowardly, but I just wanted to point out that’s not the only reason why people use an alias.
Not a rebuttal, but in the interest of furthering discussion, I prefer not to use my real name, depending on the venue, and I’ll explain why. I’ve been online since around 1990, back when everybody was using aliases, and I’ve had a few of them, and in some communities those aliases were well-known enough that people would call me by them when meeting me in real life.
I’m a nerd. I read comics, I’ve contributed to online fanzines once or twice, and I sometimes post on comic-related sites. I play City of Heroes, and a handful of other video games. I have a blog where I talk about my Doctor Who fandom, among many other things. All pretty standard nerd stuff, which I could do under my real name.
But I also own a business, providing technical writing and editing services to major publishers and software companies (I won’t name them, but they’ve got recognizable names). When a prospective client googles my name (and I’m sure they do), I want them to find the Amazon pages for the programming books I’ve co-authored, not my review of the Captain America movie. It’s good business practice for me to keep my personal and professional lives separate, and for my real name to be only attached to my professional persona.
Is it fair that I have to be “closeted” about my nerdy activities? No, I don’t think it is. It’s annoying that a prospective client would be more understanding if they found a post proclaiming my enjoyment of the Phillies this past season than one of my enjoyment of X-Factor. It’s even possible that I’m overreacting, and my prospective clients wouldn’t care, but I can’t take that risk with my revenue stream. My name is the only brand my business has, albeit a tiny brand, and I can’t risk even potential damage to it.
I’m not saying that everybody should use aliases — in our host’s case, posting something geek-related enhances his standing with the people who provide his revenue stream, so it’s a smart business decision for him. But for some of us, it’s the opposite, so I feel that I need to continue hiding my identity when I have my nerd flag flying.
Maybe it was an era-based assumption that everybody would use an alias, instead of a function of my age during that era. Either way I was a bit baffled the first time I ran across the belief that there was anything cowardly about using an alias, provided that the person wasn’t using it to attack people without fear of retaliaton.
Somewhat amusing that your post appeared while I was writing mine… Yes, it does look like we “dinos” who were using the Internet back before the web had it drummed into us the rule of “never use your real name.” It wasn’t age for me — I was a college student back then. Of course, if memory serves, our host was around on Usenet back in the day, and was using his real name at the time, as were a number of high-profile comic creators.
Of course, where that falls apart is that unless you have a one in a million last name, even if they did google it, they’d have zero reason to conclude it was you. Google “Peter David” and there are at least two others that I know of. And that doesn’t even count peterdavid.com, manufacturer of sports pins.
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PAD
I tried a Google Alert for Peter David and X-Factor for a while. It was never terribly specific, and Fox’s new TV show ruined it completely.
Of course, i have several Gravatars…
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I once Googled “Michael Weber” and included Dawsonville GA, where i was then living.
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I discovered that apparently i (Michael Weber from Dawsonville GA) was a world-famous offshore powerboat racer…
Funny thing is, I have more anonymity posting under Scott Martin (my real name) than I do using my pseudonym. Google “Scott Martin” and you get a bazillion pages of Scott Martins who aren’t me. But Google my pseudonym, which was made up by me and didn’t exist anywhere on the internet before I started using it, and every reference points directly to me. This includes DNS records for my website, so you can do a whois lookup and get my home mailing address (albeit currently an outdated one).
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It’s actually safer to use my real name.
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Thanks, Mom & Dad, for not naming me “Plippy Ploppy Cheesenose Martin.” 🙂
You’re not Joe Celko, are you?
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I’ll assume that’s directed at me, so…no. I’m not nearly famous enough to have my own Wikipedia page.
Well, here, this is me: I’ve turned my name at the top of this comment into a link to my book on Amazon; I hope that’s permitted. I’m the co-author named Brian, obviously, not my substantially more famous co-author.
I think my students know I’m a nerd. One of my daughters is named Delenn. Also, I tend to geek out with (usually the boys) when they bring in comics. Or they’ll see me reading a ST novel. Or, or, or. That’s a closet I don’t think I was ever in.
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That said, it’s sad things like that have to be hidden. It doesn’t really affect my line of work. (It may make some of the kids look at me funny… or in awe.) But really, is liking comics any weirder than liking musical theater (which I also may obsess over)? Or, like you said, sports (which I really know nothing at all about)?
I believe it was the great philosopher Herman “Herm” Edwards who said, “Put your name on it!”
Recently, this appreciation for real names has baffled me. I’m an old time internet user, and the first rule of internet was “use a handle”. I’ve used the same for 15 years. It’s what I was warned to do. It’s what I’ll keep doing. I don’t fancy it to be cowardly, and I don’t appreciate being told that it is tolerated merely because it is supposed to be tolerated, free society and all. But, hey, it’s a free society, you can say so if you wish.
No, *I* am an old time internet user. 1986, to be exact. Twenty-five years. And when I first started participating, the first rule of Internet was that pros had no business being on the Internet. People actively tried to drive me away and some claimed that I had no right to be there. That my presence had a chilling effect. People even warned me that if I said things that people disliked, they would stop reading my books and I would do myself serious harm by putting my opinions out there.
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So if *I* had listened to the warnings, it’s entirely likely this website would not exist.
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Just something to think about.
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PAD
Wow, almost Arpanet years. Well, I come from the middle years then, when you had to have a handle. Incidentally, I do have a weird rare name, but that is too specific a point for it to stick.
Having said that, a pro, or someone who is trying to promote something has, of course, an added reason in using his real name.
I think the real problem here is when a closed community has people using aliases inside of it (i.e. the comic industry), and the internet is not such.
Well, technically, it wasn’t the Internet you were using back then, was it? Compuserve, Prodigy, and the like.
He was also on Usenet at that point, Matt — and I’d say that’s about as close to “the Internet” as one could possibly find in the pre-Web era.
A possible benefit/possible problem with using your real name is getting credit if your posting is used elsewhere. While I don’t normally read romance novels, I enjoy the discussions and over-the-top descriptions on the SBTB website http://www.smartbitchestrashybooks.com . When Sarah Wendell, co-founder of the site, put together the book EVERYTHING I KNOW ABOUT ROMANCE I LEARNED FROMROMANCE NOVELS, she used (with my permission) two paragrpahs I’d posted in the book — so now I’m directly quoted in the book! (As opposed to telling friends, “Look, it may say ‘jimthered’ but it’s really me. Honest.”
The downside is that if this had happened with a site I might not want potential employers or family members to know about (like a superhero BDSM site), then I’d definitely use my standard pseudonym (and no, I’m not saying what it is here) rather than have to tell friends and family that it must be some other “Jim Lynch” who wrote the long fanfic where Cheetah violated Wonder Woman (and a lot of the Comics Code in the process).
So using your real name can be a boon if posting something you might like direct credit for, and a detriment if it’s something you want to keep private. But using a fake name just to be a troll and launch obnoxious, mean-spirited attacks remains one of the more repugnant aspects of the Internet.
Oooh – really?
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Where is it?
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Can i read it?
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Sorry to disappoint you, but those (website and story) were strictly hypothetical. (I’ve written one WW story, but with the WW2=Nazo Countess rather than a contemporary one with Cheetah.) I *will* say that doing Google searches, especially with the SafeSearch off, should get you plenty of results for this genre and characters.
(As an aside, I find it amazingly disappointing that Wonder Woman has starred in one pørņø and been partof another, yet no sign of Cheetah in either one! If there’s one villain who’d be a natural fit for WW in an adult movie, it’d have to be Cheetah.)
Peter David: And here we are, 250 years later, and we’re afraid to sign our names to our opinions because we don’t wanna get spammed or trolled?
Luigi Novi: It’s not just that. Stalking and bodily harm are also real dangers. Privacy isn’t just some theoretical idea. It’s a legitimate, practical one.
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Don’t get me wrong, I agree with your observation that some people become all brave when they’re in front of a computer screen, and say things they’d never have the guts to say to one’s face; I not only see it on blog comment sections, but run into it personally in the course of my Wikipedia work, from people who call me a “Nazi” for adhering to the site’s guidelines, even when I admonish them in the most polite and friendly way possible.
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But Peter, was there a particular incident that sparked this blog post? Did it involve Ruben Hilbers?
You’re talking to ME about the potential downsides of putting your name out there with opinions attached, Luigi? ME? After the litany of šhìŧ I listed above that’s been tossed my way over the years.
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Here’s the thing: I don’t consider myself a particularly brave guy. I don’t have a John Wayne complex. But that doesn’t stop me from speaking my mind and signing my name to it. Am I that much braver than all these other people? Are there THAT many wee, timorous beasties around? I honestly find that kind of hard to believe. People keep talking about not wanting to deal with this, that and the other thing, but really, if I can do it, I’m unclear why they can’t. And it really hasn’t been explained to my satisfaction. On the other hand, no one’s under any obligation to do so.
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PAD
Peter David: You’re talking to ME about the potential downsides of putting your name out there with opinions attached, Luigi? ME?
Luigi Novi: If you’re going to keep arguing that there aren’t legitimate reasons for using anonymity to protect your privacy, your identity and your life, and that this is distinct from trolls who use it to attack others cowardly, then YES, Peter, I’m talking to you. Do I stutter?
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Again, has that litany include stalking, identity theft, harm to your credit rating, credible threats of bodily harm, etc.? And lets say for the sake of argument that it has, and you still prefer to use your real name in all instances. That’s fine. But are you saying it’s wrong for others to not want to?
Even when we miss any point we may have been trying to make and wind up posting something complete insane, the name is still out there, good times or rain. (points at self to help try make clear this is not meant as commentary on anybody else’s posts)
Wow, talk about the elephant in the room! While I’ve always used my real name, even in chatrooms (remember IRC?), even when it’s led to harassment, I also recognize my privilege in being a white heterosexual woman from a fairly well-off background who has as close to a permanent job as anyone can these days. Lots of people, particularly lots of other women, can’t say that. Lots of folks are domestic abuse victims whose partners sitll stalk them, or have experienced gay-bashing, or have had death threats lobbed at them, all for daring to speak their mind online. Not talking about the comics community for the most part, more the political/cultural communities, but this sort of thing is very, very real, and quite a good reason why many people choose online anonymity or pseudonymity.
First, I’d like to point out that I do agree with PAD on everything he said. Especially the part where people use aliases to be disrespectful and act like they never would in real life, hiding behind aliases to hurt people and not thinking twice about the fact there are other human beings behind those computer screens. I always found that disgusting.
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But, as others have said, I started using the internet when it first became widely known. Granted, I was about 20 years old and an adult then, but still, the rule was to never use your real name. So I didn’t.
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I mostly used chat programs like IRC and you never saw people with their real name there. I am also a big gamer and I use mostly used my alias in games. I don’t know, creating a character in a fantasy or sci-fi video game with my real name attached to it seems like pretty stupid to me. So I started going by reboot about 12 years ago in a game called Unreal Tournament.
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So when I began to go to forums to talk about this or other games, I kept the same name, so people who knew me in the game could recognize me. Same thing happened when I started talking about comic books or any other subject I like. I wanted people who already knew me online to recognize me so I kept the same alias for 12 years.
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My alias, on the internet, is probably more recognizable than my real name. So, no, my alias is not for hiding myself and my opinions, but for the exact opposite. So if people know me in a game or message board, and they read this, for example, they’ll know it’s me and that’s what I want. My real name to them has no meaning. This alias does, though.
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Believe it or not, I’ve been banned from chat rooms and message boards because whenever I post somewhere, I want to discuss my opinions in a very respectful way and I often critiqued, politely, others who starts being disrespectful and calling names and insulting others. I was told that they can voice their opinions too, even if that includes name calling and insults, because we are on the internet, so I was the one banned because I was willing to continue the conversation politely and not accept that bad behavior to me or to other people.
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And, like I said before, it disgusts me. So I agree with PAD 100% on that one.
I used an alias when I played Unreal Tournament. But I wasn’t sharing opinions there; I was just blowing other players up.
Yyyyyyeah, not the same thing…
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PAD
Oh, I know. reboot’s mention of the game just got me all nostalgic for telefragging.
The only point I was trying to make about my alias, is that I became known, first in Unreal Tournament, and then on many many other sites.
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That alias means something to a lot more people than my real name is. And that is why I do not think I am hiding with it.
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And yeah, Michael, I miss telefragging too, that was so fun 🙂
I post under my own name here and on some other sires, where i feel comfortable doing so.
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On others, i generally use “Fairportfan” – a name with eleven years of Internet history behind it, quite possibly known to more people than know me by “mike weber”, and i make no particular effort to hide my real name.
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In fact, on sites that require registration, i usually have my real name in the profile.
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It’s just whichever feels right.
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Now, on sites like The Daily Beast or Yahoo News, where the debate can get seriously toxic and i’m not real sure how sane everyone posting is (well, i’m fairly sure how unsane some of them are), i have an assortment of disposable aliases because (A) i don’t care if none of those people know who i really am, and (B) i actively don’t want some of them to know…
I use my first name or sometimes my online screen name on here… I don’t think I’ve ever used my full name. It’s somewhat a desire for anonymity. My screen name isn’t really a secret to real life people, though.
Mostly when I get involved in political discussions, I try not to let my opinions influence my students. I honestly doubt they’ll ever come across this particular blog. My students know I vote; I wear the ‘I voted today’ sticker. But I want them to learn to do their own research and make their own decisions on issues. I don’t want them to go to Miss Miriam (which is actually what they call me, I don’t know why I’m the only teacher at my school who isn’t called by last name, but it’s been that way for seven years now) and go with what she likes… or doesn’t.
That said, even when I use my screenname (mimiheart) I try not to act in a way that’s different from how I would act IRL. I’m always aware that there are other people on the other side of the screen. I think that in general, discourse in the public has just gone downhill, and I’m not sure how much anonymity has to do with it and how much people forgetting that other people are human beings does.
I’m fairly sure that Mrs. David can attest that i don’t talk all that differently from behind a keyboard than i do in real life – somewhat more baroque sentence structure, a tendency to be a bit crankier than IRL, but, i think, still recognisably me.
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I’ve been watching flame wars fly around since before there was an internet – heck, since pretty much before there were personal computers, back when you used a typewriter and a mimeograph to get in people’s faces every other month in an amateur press alliance.
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There is no new thing under the sun.
I probably go on longer at times online. How often, unless you’re actually giving a speech, do you actually get to have a few paragraphs to express yourself in person? Usually it’s a sentence back and forth without much time to think what you’re going to say.
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I started playing on the internet in eighth grade, and really getting on it in ninth grade, and it was brand new and shiny then. And I wasn’t in the least bit interested in politics at the time. I think the closest I got to a flame war was with some online people on a mailing list on whether or not Harry Kim or Tom Paris was cuter. (Oh, mid-90s, I miss you.) And I think I had the same discussion with my real friends on the bus ride home every day.
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No new thing under the sun, maybe I’ve just grown up and discovered it. I don’t like it much.
Not sure what precipitated this, but OK, I’ll take it. Not sure that using my name was ever a conscious decision on my part – just always kind of have. So much information about me is out there and readily available already, I guess I never really was overly concerned about whether my comments tracked back or not – besides that I’m occasionally kind of a dork, I don’t think there’s too much more to learn from them. At least, I hope that’s how I’m conducting myself.
And here we are, 250 years later, and we’re afraid to sign our names to our opinions because we don’t wanna get spammed or trolled?
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After reading many of the comments here it’s clear that the fear is far more legitimate than that makes it sound. There are certainly lots of folks out there who are all to ready to take advantage of and do real world damage to folks they find online. From identity theft to getting in the cross-hairs of a severely disturbed person (whatever spectrum that makes).
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There are legitimate reasons to provide yourself some level of anonymity when posting online, particularly in the places where discussions are more likely to get heated.
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I’ve seen many folks who use aliases here who are well behaved. I’ve seen many folks who use their own names who are trolling áššhølëš. Using a handle or alias isn’t what should be pointed to and criticized. Yes, the availability of a mask does lead many folks to jerks, but it’s the behavior that should be criticized, not that they wear a mask.
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A note of appreciation… for the startling number of people here and elsewhere who post reasoned comments, be it under their own names or a handle.
Thank you. What you said is exactly what I think and I omitted most of it in my long winded post above because it was…well…long winded enough as is.
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So, thank you for summarizing what I was about to say in a second post, which was about to be twice as long as yours but less well said.
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I’ll blame my first language, french. Although people in real life tend to get bored anyways when I explain things, you don’t know that 😛
After reading many of the comments here it’s clear that the fear is far more legitimate than that makes it sound.
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Ever see “Strictly Ballroom?”
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Vivir con miedo es como vivir a medias
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PAD
No, I haven’t.
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una vida terminada por un acosador es mitad de la vida
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Foolishly ignoring reasonable precautions is not a wise way to go.
I don’t disagree, but on the other hand, for how many people is it a reasonable precaution…and for how many is it a chance to say all manner of things that they’d never dare say if their names were on it? And is that a good thing?
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I think the easiest way to judge is comparing the level of discussion on boards where people attach their names to the discussion level where people are anonymous. I think that in the latter case you find way more jerks, far more belligerence, and way more name calling. I kind of prefer what we have here, and I think that since we have a considerable portion who are unafraid to sign their names, I’m simply positing that maybe there’s a connection.
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PAD
I agree. I think it’s obvious that folks who use (what appear to be) their real names are a) less likely to be trolls/jerks by nature and b) less likely to post something obnoxious in the heat of a moment knowing their name will be on it.
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As someone who has had to involve the DA and the FBI when someone took offense and seriously overreacted to something I posted, I don’t begrudge anyone from grabbing anonymity. Again, I’ll go more by how they conduct themselves than what they call themselves.
While I totally understand the motivations some people have posted for using aliases (professional concerns or things like the scenario Elayne has laid out), I’m certainly in the “use your real name” camp barring strong reasons to do otherwise.
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Like Miss Miriam :-), I’m a teacher. A few years ago we had a speaker come to school who was really terrible, and some students actually went to the extent of setting up a Facebook group specifically to badmouth her. A great kerfuffle developed (to put it mildly), and some kids got into relatively significant trouble.
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I wasn’t involved with that specifically, but after it all broke I did talk to my classes about it a bit. I essentially said, “I know next to nothing about Facebook and don’t know exactly what was posted … but I do know that I’m one of the few faculty members here who’s been online since before you were born. My lesson here: stand behind your convictions. I’ve got tens of thousands of words online, easily Google-able in most cases, and it probably wouldn’t take you more than 20 minutes to find something I wrote that I’d now find embarrassing. Go for it this weekend, if you like. But note that I always, always stood by what I said. I think that’s basic to any reasonable conversation.”
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A few kids heard me, I think — not enough, but even one is an improvement.
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If there are places where comments are really meant to be disposable (e.g. YouTube or something like it), that might be different — all I know is that I tend not to frequent such places for conversation.
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And like Miriam, my students realize really really quickly that I’m pretty geeky. (I don’t have a child named Delenn, but I do have a unit where I use a B5 clip for pedagogical purposes.) Since I teach physics and astronomy, they’d probably be surprised if I weren’t!
I teach a weird hybrid of religion, music, and language (Hebrew, but half the time I end up having to teach English to teach Hebrew). I wish geeky stuff came up more often in actual lessons. I’ve had the ‘stand behind what you say no matter where you say it’ lesson before. I teach fourth through seventh grade.
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There’s only one place online where I don’t use my actual name (don’t recall now the reasons why); but I have, from time to time, posted links to things I’ve written elsewhere where I do use my name. So regulars to that board probably can learn who I am, if they’ve a mind. Plus my first name is part of my user name.
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And speaking of things I’ve written elsewhere, Silver Blade Magazine (www.silverblade.net) has now published all nine installments of my serialized novella, Kestor.
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Tim, I take you at your word that Tim Lynch is your real name. But say, for the sake of argument, that teachers at your school weren’t allowed to post things online under their own names (or were strongly discouraged from doing so), and you created an “alias” using your middle name and your mother’s maiden name (or your middle name and last name)? Would that really make much of a difference? In either case, from a certain point of view (as Obi Wan might have put it), it’s still your name.
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Granted, you’re on slightly firmer ground if your name is Tim and you tell your students that posts can be found under “Tim”, than if your given name is actually George; but the fact that you’re willing to point them to things you’ve written online is probably more important than the name or “handle” used.
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Of course, some people don’t go by their given names. My uncle, who never went online, went by his middle name all his life (he never cared for his first name). Unless you knew his first name (and/or what city he lived in), a Google search, or any sort of public records search, would probably fail to find him. And if he’d posted here, no one would know if the given name he used was actually his first name. They would have presumably weighed his words based more on what he said than what “handle” he’d have used.
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I’m sure there are examples on boards all over the Internet where someone using a “handle” has more thoughtful and reasoned posts than someone posting under an actual name. On boards like this one that have “regulars”, most people would soon learn to “shroud” the one who uses a name (whether his or her real one) and accept the one using a “handle” at face value.
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Again, I’ve no problem using my name online (and agree there’s something to be said for putting your John Hancock to what you write), but to paraphrase the Emperor Claudius in I, Claudius, isn’t what a person says on a blog or message board more important than the user name with which he says it?”
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Rick
Hi Rick,
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You’re right that it’s generally more about the substance than the speaker, or should be. I think PAD’s point is that anonymity tends to foster dickwad behavior, since people feel that anonymity = total lack of consequences. It’s not inevitable by any means, but it’s problematic.
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Now that said, you’re totally right that if it’s an alias that you’ve used for years or decades and are known by, it’s much the same effect. It’s not the One True Name™ that matters, but the willingness to stand by your words.
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So basically, I think we’re arguing the same side of the street here!
This whole discussion takes me back to more than a year ago, when Blizzard (the maker of games like World of Warcraft and Starcraft) decided that they would make people accountable for everything said in their forum and will force people to use their real name.
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I saw their point and agreed with it, since their forums were populated by flamers and was one of the less constructive forums around. But forcing people to use their real name is something I don’t agree with and thus was against it.
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Most people were against it, of course. Some people found the name of a couple Blizzard employees on the site and, to prove their point, 15 minutes later, emailed them (on an email that wasn’t public) their address, name of their parents, where they live and their age.
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They found that out by legal means, like facebook and doing research on the internet. No hacking was involved.
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Of course, most people will never resort to that sort of acts to threaten people, but it could happen. If you are a public figure like PAD, there is nothing you can do about it, the information is out there anyways. But if you’re a regular joe, I understand that some people might be afraid of that.
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Of course, if they are afraid of it because they like to attack people on the internet, insult them and harrass them, it’s one thing. But most people are just afraid people that some psychopath will track them just because they hate their political opinions or they are infatuated with them and want to meet them in real life or something like that.
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There might not be a huge chance of that happening but yes, I do understand that some people might want to stay anonymous. In many cases it has nothing to do with not assuming what they are saying, but just not willing to take any chances.
Most people were against it, of course. Some people found the name of a couple Blizzard employees on the site and, to prove their point, 15 minutes later, emailed them (on an email that wasn’t public) their address, name of their parents, where they live and their age.
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Exactly why I don’t have a problem with folks using aliases. Blizzard should have, instead of insisting on real names, insisted on acceptable behavior.
After that event and all the rage from the fans, they retracted and decided against it. They enforce the rules a little more than before and the forums are much less abrasive than before.
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Although, of course, most of the posts are not constructive and just whining, but that was to be expected, real names wouldn’t have changed that in the slightest 🙂
When I connected to the internet back in the mid ’90s it simply never occurred to me to use any name but my own and I’ve never had any reason to create an alias though I often just use my first name for convenience. I recognized early on that having my name on whatever I post keeps me ‘honest’ and I’ve deleted many a long post because I wasn’t being, as my mother would have called it, my ‘best self’.
Thank you, Peter, for what you said in the opening of this entry. (Sniffle)
I’ve used “Queen Anthai” as my internet handle since 1999, which you can clearly see as I am old enough to still call it a “handle.” I use it dámņ near everywhere, to the point where some people will not recognize me without it AHEM PETER <3, but it's not for anonymity reasons. I am perfectly capable of signing "Dayna Abel" to everything and I get weirded if people call me by "Anthai" in real life. I consider my handle sort of my brand name. There's no confusing who's behind it, and I'm a real person who stands behind everything "queenanthai" says. It's not so much hiding behind a screenname as it is just being me, with a cooler-looking name. XD
-Dayna
Yup, that’s exactly it. Everybody in real life knows my handle. Those who do not know me in real life coudn’t care less for my real name. So, if I wanted to be anonymous to those who don’t know me in real life, I’d have to use my real name 😛
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Also, my real name is a french name. I’ve told it to many english speakers before and most of the time, they insisted to call me reboot instead, cause they had a hard time writing it or saying it.
I give you guys my first name. Is that enough? My name is Adam and the YJ is just because I liked Young Justice a lot. Anyway, I generally try to treat people right no matter what I’m doing and where I’m talking to people. Most arguments I get into online stem more from people misunderstanding the point I’m trying to make. I’d never “bash” someone. Why? Fake name or not, it’s still me. And the way I see it, I should be the hero of my own story, not the villian. I know it’s an odd way of phrasing it, but I think you get my point.
I started using my pseudonym when I first ventured into blogs, back in 2003, when we were all being told to protect our privacy. And I’ve stuck with that identity, pretty much all across the blogosphere, While there are relatively few links that tie “Jay Tea” to the meatspace me, I have kept that one identity for about eight years, and stick with it wherever I meander around the web.
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Recently a guy interrupted a mugging and chased down the mugger. He demanded the woman’s purse back, the mugger drew a gun, and the good samaritan shot and killed the mugger. There was some question about whether or not he would be charged; the prosecutor said the samaritan had acted legally and heroically.
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I view folks who use their real names online a bit like I view that good samaritan; I praise their courage, I question their wisdom. And, to a degree, I envy their bravery.
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J.
Rene Narciso Pavan. My full name. I usually don’t post under my full name on message boards simply because it sounds formal and I see boards as the same as walking into a bar and having a few bears with the guys and talking bûllšhìŧ. You don’t need to know everybody else’s full name in such situations.
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But I don’t exactly hide it either.
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Obviously, anonyminity is a big part of people acting like jerks in the Internet, but not the only one. There were times in my life when I acted like a jerk when arguing in the Internet with friends who knew me in real life.
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The physical removal, the lack of real empathetic clues, is a FAR more powerful motivator of jerkish behaviour than anonyminity, IMO.
Because of your progressive views I found it surprising and sad that you have been harassed but you are very brave to continue to express your views.
There have been media figures like yourself that have publicly made their political views known and have paid a price for it.
So I understand those media figures who don’t make their views known to the world.
Norm Breyfogle on his site has stated one the reasons or his unemployment from DC and Marvel has been because of his political views.
John Byrne is another one that comes to mind, his website and his strong comments on it are almost overshadowing his amazing body of work.
Even though, I agree with most of your political views, I don’t get involved in your political articles because I’m just not into politics that much and frankly there are millions of other sites for that stuff, like the Huffington Post.
I come to your site for your unique comic book insight not politics.
Maybe a small part of me doesn’t want to know my heroes personal views, I rather have them save the world, eat apple pie and fly away, i’m nutty that way.
Now that you have shared with us some of the problems your political views have caused you, do you ever worry that this stuff will take away from your great body of work?
Peter you will always be known to me as a terrific, entertaining and a must read author.
Jose.
I think Ive given my real name here a couple of times; Juan Porras Hernández. I posted in forums and IRC as MaesePorras for some years but I started using my present handle because, after all, that’s how my oldest friends call me often in real life. I ‘ve kept it segregated just enough so shallow google searchs wont result in an instant conection, I’ve written about work and politics in my blog quite often and as I’ve said before, I worked as an autonomous contractor for some years and every new client is a potential new google scoop.
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Then, the only places I still comment apart from these threads is a forum where I know (and party with) around 30% of the regulars, making my handle more of a nom de guerre than a real mask to hide under.
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And now that I think of it, I think I am the only one using his real photo as an avatar 🙂
Peter, at the risk of sounding like a total kiss-ášš, I have to agree with just about everything you said. As a journalist, it goes completely against my grain to hide behind an assumed name. When I express an opinion, I do so with the full knowledge that I have to accept the criticism or consequences of everything I say. Using a made-up name or playing a character online means you don’t necessarily have to have the courage of your convictions, because you’re never held accountable for them. That’s just how I feel
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While I don’t necessarily agree with some people who feel it necessary to continue using a ‘handle’ simply because that’s what they’ve always done, I’m perfectly happy to live and let live. If, like most people who post on this forum, you comport youself like a reasonable human being, I personally don’t care if you wear a blue hoodie and call yourself the Cookie Monster. But- and I think this is one of the points that Peter was trying to make- if you use a made-up name as a smokescreen for acting like a total dìçkhëád, I can’t respect your point of view, because you don’t have the courage to stand behind your own name. And for the most part, I notice the particularly nasty ones that occasionally infect this site with their toxicity are generally given the bum’s rush or at least made fun of for their rank stupidity. And that’s the way it should be.
Peter, at the risk of sounding like a total kiss-ášš, I have to agree with just about everything you said.
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Take the risk!
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PAD
I do have a one in a million, I’d argue a 1 in a 7 billion name but I still use my whole name because it is important. Plus, i really have never met anyone outside my family with this last name. In a way, its like a digital legacy for future historians to know more about me.
Yeah, but your biggest potential problem is someone tricking you into same your name backwards and sending you back to the 5th dimension…
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PAD
hsssss
Someone wanna help Mike? He appears to be deflating.
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PAD
No — he’s just trying to tell the 5th dimension to be quiet.
You know what? I get the notion that people say they use pseudonyms to be cautious. So this begs a question:
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Has anyone here who posts under his real name ever had any problems resulting from that decision?
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Stalkers? Trolls. Harassment?
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Seriously, I’m curious.
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PAD
Years ago, I was part of a BBS where handles were encouraged, if not required (I don’t recall) so I used one. Late one night, I got an argument with two people in one of the bbs’s chatrooms. One of them I knew offline, and he messaged the one I didn’t know with my name, address, and phone number, at which point the guy I didn’t know started threatening me (claiming he was going to come over and fight, and used my address as proof), called my phone once, and then hung up. I was much younger and scared, and eventually the bbs operator came into the chatroom and put things to rights.
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These days I would just call the police and/or forward the message if things went that far, but being much younger I was scared and didn’t know what to do.
Okay, well, that is certainly a crappy thing to have to deal with. But if I’m understanding you correctly, the problem stemmed not from you being public, but because someone who already knew you decided to be a total dìçk. He could just as easily have contacted the guy and said, “Fluffybunny43 is actually Jonathan Roth, and here his personal info.” Yes?
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PAD
Personally? No. But blogger Jeff Goldstein of Protein Wisdom found himself the target of a serial psychopath stalker who repeatedly threatened him and his family (including very specific sexual threats against his then-three-year-old son) that got so bad Goldstein had to stop blogging for a while and got the authorities involved.
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Said stalker turned out to be a college professor, who was fired. She’s also got a lengthy criminal record for stalking and harassment and threats, and has been turning her rage on officials who she thinks have crossed her. I’ve lost count of how many orders to stay offline and leave certain people alone she’s violated, but she’s actually served jail time over her obsessions. Google up D e b o r a h F r i t s c h for more details.
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And blogger/columnist/commentator Michelle Malkin had to move her family from DC to Colorado after her enemies publicized her home address and made some very ugly, very specific death threats against them.
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I guess I’m lucky that I haven’t inspired that level of passion, but I have seen it happen.
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J.
In justice, I kind of remember Malkin encouraging her followers to give a piece of their mind to the family of some kids that appeared in some healthcare ads or messages. This was still during Bush admin. She gave that family’s adress in her blog. So while I cant condone the harassment of Malkin’s family, whatever distress she might have personally suffered can only count as karma.
Oh, boy, here I go again, off on another tangent…
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Hombre, you’re conflating two separate Malkin incidents.
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1) During the S-CHIP fight, the Democrats cited a certain family as one that really, really needed the program for their kids. Malkin did some checking on the family’s story. The family had a big house, two new cars, and both parents had given up quite lucrative jobs to go into self-employment. In other words, their “need” for S-CHIP coverage was based on putting other priorities above providing insurance for their children. Malkin’s “offense” was in not taking the Democrats’ description of the family’s situation at face value, and providing a lot of relevant details to the public. She didn’t pick some family at random; this family had agreed to let themselves become the “poster children” of the cause.
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2) A bunch of college students at US Santa Cruz put up flyers calling for an anti-military demonstration on campus, and included their names and phone numbers as contacts over the rally. Malkin reprinted the flyer on her blog, without removing the names and numbers.
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Personally, I don’t see the problem with either. In the first case, the family had consented to having their situation publicized to promote a political cause; Malkin simply found that there were a lot more relevant information than they or the Democrats were letting on. In the second, the students had put themselves out as points of contact; she simply promulgated their message to a far wider market.
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Which, actually, ties back into PAD’s original point, of what can happen when one uses one’s own name and identity publicly…
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J.
Okay – that’s a crazy lady.
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(BTW – no “T” in her last name.)
It’s been some years but in that family’s incident (the other one I didnt even knew of) I kind of remember Malkin giving away the family’s info, and that resulted on some of her fans appearing at their doorstep. Without discussing what the family did (I remember that debate), I think what Malkin did was reckless under any angle. Choosing to become the poster child for any cause doesnt equate with giving away your right to not have your address posted on a million visit site.
No real trouble but I’ve gotten some emails from folks thinking I’m really somebody else and I did have to block one person’s emails completely.
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I’m an active fan of a writer who shares my initials and he’s generally known by them. In a few cases I’ve gotten messages from people who wonder if I’m actually him in ‘disguise’. In all but the one case nobody’s pushed the idea when I’ve explained that I’m a) female, b) far too short and c) not nearly a good enough writer to be him.
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What I’ve always enjoyed a bit is how my name comes across as either male or female depending whether the reader is USian or European. When all you’ve got to go by is the name and what’s written it can be hard to tell.
I always use my real name and last summer I was on AMC theaters comment board when the Sarah Palin documentary was released. I got into a debate with a few people who were criticizing and boycotting AMC for screening this movie. (I posted about it here on PAD’a board, noting how vicious some of the responses were and contrasting it with the atmosphere here).
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Anyway the critics were all using pseudonyms and I pointed out that this seriously compromised their credibility. One poster, Doublet Daddy, said I was being naive and reckless by using my real name. He said there are lots of crazies and wackos on the internet and apparently to prove himself right he told me he Googled me, found my home address, a satellite picture of my house and told me several things about the local theaters in St. Louis.
I said, “Come on by and we can have a face-fo-face debate.” He never showed up or responded to my invitation on the board. He may have been telling the truth but when I Google my name, I do not get my home address, just a lot of posts I’ve made on comic sites.
I have had letters printed in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch where they print your name but not your address, and have received unsigned hate mail from people who apparently looked my name up in the phone book.
I do not worry about it. I am fairly confident they all hat and no cowboy.
I personally have not, but I have a friend who once posted a little rant after an argument with his father, related to said Father’s job. This was on a tiny board with less that 20 members, and somehow, what he said about Dad’s company filtered back and caused a shitstorm for the whole family.
It can happen.
And while I use a pseudonym, it’s one that is directly tied to me, as it’s the name of my little short film production company. It’s easy enough to find my real name – Jeremy Orr.
I personally have not, but I have a friend who once posted a little rant after an argument with his father, related to said Father’s job.
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Well, that was just dumb on his part.
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I mean, hëll, if I had a problem with one of my editors, I wouldn’t start bìŧçhìņg about it on my site. Sure, sign your name, but use SOME common sense.
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This is why I miss APAs. That was a limited venue where you could vent about stuff, and it was mimeographed and distributed to a limited audience. It didn’t wind up in the hands of someone you didn’t want to see it.
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PAD
You’re likely far too busy, but APAs haven’t all gone away. I’m in two general interest ones, one of which I started over 27 years back (APAPLEXY), and which still come out every six weeks or so in paper format. For my money it’s a more fun way for friends and acquaintances to keep in touch than Facebook (less spam, too) and collations are a good excuse for a social evening.
An ex-girlfriend did. She’d used her name on a BBS, and a somewhat overzealous individual called her at three in the morning to creep her out/complain about her posts.
It was actually to avoid stalkers and/or harrassment that I stopped putting my last name in. My wife’s family are not nice people, and she lives in dread of them finding us or our son. Now, I used to track people down for a living, so I know how easy it can be, but it makes her more comfortable.
Not due to posting here specifically. I did have one problem with Richard Arnold calling me at my place of business, but that was a one-time problem which was easily resolved.
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I’ve never had any real issues here. Strangely, I did have an issue on IMDB (where I post as JJChandler) thanks to a jáçkášš that has no life and has wasted years of his life on an internet crusade against Ron Moore and the new BSG and recently StarGate Universe.
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No, that’s not hyperbole.
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The guy is insane. He posts on dozens of sites all day long and posts dozens of posts on each site. And each and every post is just rant after rant about his least favorite person and least favorite TV shows. Anyone and everyone who disagrees with him about his statements about the shows being bad and Moore being a horrible writer are either people who have been brainwashed by the Sci-Fi/Syfy “stealth marketers” on the web or are in fact dummy accounts owned and used by the Sci-Fi/Syfy “stealth marketers.”
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Not long ago he decided to up the stupidity factor by trying to hunt down info on the web of several of the posters on IMDB (and I’m sure on other sites) who posted with variations of their real names. He then started making cutesy little remarks to people that tried to imply that he now had personal info on them and making vague comments about dealing with the Syfy stealth marketers. This basically ended badly for him in at least two ways. First, despite posting under fake names (spiderr987, spiderrsrevenge, GINOsuks, GINOblows, GINOgoneforever, etc) he then turned around and set up personal profiles on social and professional networking (myspace, facebook, linkedin, etc) sites where he used whatever name of the moment he had while posting his real name and photos of himself. Yes, he is a moron. Took no time at all to scare the piss out of him by pointing out that pretty much everyone could find out who he was, where he lived and see what he looked like with only about ten minutes of effort. It freaked him out a bit more that we pointed out that he was about two or three posts away from having the local authorities knocking on his door. He got quiet posting-wise for a bit after that. And, issue number two for him, I’m pretty sure his most recent IMDB account (he’s been banned under five or six of them) got suspended.
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It really struck me as odd during and after this little incident. I post about some serious things in various places (including here and my own blog) that deal with political issues, things related to my line of work and zombie “experts” who are full of it. So what finally gets me a short-term harassing wanna-be cyber-stalker? My liking the new BSG, SG-U and some of Ron Moore’s other works because an anal nutball can’t believe that people out there actually like those things and would disagree with his POV about them.
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Life: Stranger than fiction and then some.
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And, yeah, despite how that last bit comes across, I know Moore didn’t have anything to do with SG-U. He just lumped it into his rants because it was, in his words, Syfy trying to force their failed BSG on us by ruining another franchise with Moore-like ideas.
So, he was saying they were Moore or less the same show.
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I’m mooretified that you would find humor in that pun, Sean.
“Here lies Les Moore. No Les, no Moore.”
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PAD
Peter David says:
November 3, 2011 at 11:34 am
“Here lies Les Moore. No Les, no Moore.”
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PAD
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The actual tombstone I read about read
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Here lies Les Moore
Killed with 3 shots from a .44
No Les
No Moore.”
I once told someone who was advertising their services as a web designed that their designs weren’t very impressive. Specifically, that using blue text on a navy background was hard to read.
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It was somewhat indelicately phrased, but still basically innocuous. And in response to that one comment, well, as contemporaneously noted by my best friend, who really bore the brunt of it what followed included:
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“… months of abuse and harassment in the form of over 600 electronic messages and emails to my family and myself [and friends] involving, among other things, false and heinous allegations of child prostitution, rape, and incest, [threats to be sued ]…”
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Plus threats of physical violence (specifically described), intimidation, attempts to interfere in livelihoods, etc. As mentioned earlier, the local DA and FBI got involved.
You know what? I get the notion that people say they use pseudonyms to be cautious. So this begs a question:
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Actually, it raises a question. 🙂
I wouldn’t say problems… I’ve had people hold my opinions against me, and use it to blacklist me in unrelated contexts. But like you, that’s a risk I’m willing to take.
Megan’s parents Googled me when we were first dating. I guess I’m lucky they were okay with what they found.
I’m not sure if you’d call it “trouble” really, but…
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Back when I was doing a lot of reviews on USENET (Rec.arts.comics… etc) and mo own website (now defunct, so not trying to plug anything). I always posted under “Spooon” (or Spooon-fed Review) but with my name clearly shown at the bottom with contact email, etc.
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I reviewed one series “Dr. Tomorrow” and one day was surprised to find in my inbox an email from someone demanding that I remove my review from my site because it “violated his copyright of the name ‘Dr. Tomorrow.'” This guy was in no way connected to the comic book — and in fact claimed that the comic book was in vilation of his copyright as well — but was threatened legal action, etc. I sent him a polite email and got a response that “it’s in our lawyers hands, then.”
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Now, nothing ever came of this, but anonymity would have saved me at least 30 minutes of confusion and a call to me sister the layer.
If I was in a more sophomoric mood, I might take you task for impugning the morals of your sister. OTOH, I assume you meant to type “lawyer”, so I suppose the impugning goes either way…
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🙂
A friend had to hire a private detective to stop the harassment from a troll on AOL who sent emails to the principal of the high school where she teaches to spread lies about her sexual habits, then posted similar comments about her on a forum for her students.
He and a few others tried to find out more about me, but unlike her, I don’t use my real, full name online because I am very Google-able. Even 5-6 years ago, there were 3 of us coming up when I searched. One was me, one was half my age, and one had a different middle initial. Last I checked, there were almost a dozen of us. I still stand out, and now that I blog under my real name for work, very findable. I want to keep my personal life separate from my work life, and this way, I can say things about work without work knowing, because if they found out, I’d get in trouble.
So, if that makes me a coward, I’m a coward. An opinionated, stubborn coward. 😉
*Shrug* Well, you’re talking to someone who’s complained regularly about decisions made at various places of business of his, in print, in a regular newspaper column, that’s guaranteed to be read by the people he’s complaining about.
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I’m just not comfortable expressing opinions from hiding.
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PAD
PAD, you know what? I get the notion that you don’t see a large enough downside to non-anonymous posting to warrant the anonymity. So this raises a question:
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What is the most significant problem that was caused by posting complaints about decisions at places of business of yours under your real name?
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Lost income? Fired from assignments? Did you have any legitimate worries that an editor would stalk, harass, and post deplorable lies about you?
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Seriously, I’m curious.
I am a history teacher and I have had students try to look me up. I’m not that hard to find online. I never put anything up online I wouldn’t freely say in class or in public. I have had students tell me they have looked me up and tried to find out things about me. There isn’t much interesting to find. People have asked me about my Disney wedding etc because they found out about it online. Even if I never posted something, my name pops up in database stuff etc. That’s the price of freedom. I told one of my students today “with great freedom comes great responsibility” and he said “I thought it was with great power” and I replied “same thing!”
My name isn’t quite as unique. I think if you google it, after my google plus account and facebook, which I never use, you get some reports of a teacher who was killed in Ridgeport. (That’s not disturbing at all. I had one student ask me when I died. Then I looked it up.) The ‘Miriam’ part is more unique than my last name.
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Then again, because I don’t usually use my real name when posting in things like this, I don’t have my name highlighted all over the internet either.
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True about freedom=power. Good for the student to learn that now.
You had a Disney wedding? How was that? I had a Disney proposal and Disney honeymoon, but not a Disney wedding.
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PAD
I remember reading about how you proposed in Disney. I read that entry to my wife. It’s a shame that the Adventurers Club is no longer.
On to the wedding. The wedding was fantastic! We got married at the Yacht Club in the wedding gazebo. Disney does a really good job of making sure you stick to whatever budget you give them. Believe it or not, the wedding was really cheap compared to some weddings I’ve heard about. We spent the bare minimum. My wife wore her grandmothers dress which was from the 1940’s. Everyone loved it because no one had seen a dress so well preserved or that “old fashioned.” I wore Klingon cuff links and so did my brother who was my number one…er…best man.
We had the reception at Ariels and our rehearsal dinner was at Kouzzina.
The best part aside from getting married is that when you get married at Disney, they give you special gold wedding watches.
We did not have any characters at our wedding because they are too expensive. We did go to a character breakfast the next day. My wife loves Disney a lot and has been there many, many times so she knew everywhere to do to make sure we had a great time.
All in all, it was the best time of my life.
It was amazing! I never got to go into the Adventurers’ Club because most of the trips I was too young, and then by the time I was old enough it was closed, but we did take a look at it and peek through the windows because my husband had told me you got engaged there. My parents have also been there. It sounded so cool! I wish I had gotten to go.
i post under this name, because this is the name other comic geeks know me as.
You make a good point, Mr. David. I never gave it much thought before, mostly because my real name affords more anonymity than my “handle”. In my case, I guess I thought an alias would make me more recognizable–I mean, a Google search of my name yields so many results that I simply can’t filter through them to find myself. But, upon reflection, I can see how an alias is like a mask: the person behind it may be completely benign, but how can one tell? So, I’ll remove the mask on those occasions when I feel I have something to contribute. Incidentally, as I step into the light I reveal myself as one who suffers from an affliction you are clearly all too familiar with: three first names! –William John Thomas
PAD inquired: “Has anyone here who posts under his real name ever had any problems resulting from that decision?”
Not here, no. And nothing very serious. However, some years back, I saw someone’s post (can’t even remember the original venue at this point) which I thought was very humorous and clearly tongue-in-cheek. I posted a sequel of sorts to the original post, and started getting a variety of e-mail about it. Some enjoyed it, some thought I was being insulting to a particular group, some thought I must belong to that group. No threats, no real consequences.
But for a number of years after that, since nothing on the Internet ever really dies, every so often it would somehow pop up again, often without the context of the original post that had triggered it, and I’d get a new little spate of e-mails.
Despite that…I tend to be fairly open about the use of my real name. I’m fortunate to have a job with a rough equivalent of tenure, and professional colleagues with excellent senses of humor. Since, for example, my Facebook friends include colleagues, high school and college buddies, comics folks, gaming folks, students in the campus organizations I advise, etc. – groups which have a relatively small area of intersection – all have learned about my general geekiness, and no one has shunned me for it.
Now if I ever posted about my role as an undercover assassin for the Betelgeusean Empire … oops!
Did I err?
Internet Rule #1 (in my own book, mind you) is: Anonymity Breeds Úšhølìšm.
I, um, strive to be the exception to that rule. Not always successfully, but I at least try. ^.^;
Wildcat
Yeah, but if things get rough you have your boxing experience and Justice Society of America membership to fall back on. How many others here have those advantages?
But but but… secret identity is *secret*! :O
In answer to your question, Peter, I’ve never had a single problem pertaining to posts on this site. In fact, there have been two or three instances where folks in another venue have noticed a post here and mentioned it.
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Regarding a few previous posts about Malkin et al, while I don’t particularly want to stir up that pot, I think it’s safe to say that if one traffics in hate speech, it’s easy for that toxic energy to be reflected back on the person that initiated it. If you put people’s addresses up on your website with targets around them for example, you don’t have a lot of moral high ground to stand on when somebody threatens your own life. Believe me, I’m not supporting that kind of behavior, but I firmly believe that karma has a way of biting you in the ášš when you least expect it.
As one of the folks that always signs his real name, thanks for the compliment, PAD.
For my part, that’s been my style ever since I first came online, and so far as I know, nothing bad has ever happened to me as a result of it. No stalking, no harassment on message boards or what-have-you…nothing. Then again, I’m not on anyone’s radar. No one knows me from a hole in the wall. And if my commentary anywhere has kept me from getting a job offer…well, no one has made me aware of it, so I can’t say.
Like others who’ve posted here, I never seriously considered using a pseudonym just because I can. Maybe I’m an egotist or something, but I’ve always felt that if I have something to say, and I’m willing to put it in a public forum, I ought to have the courage to sign my name to it.
Complete disclosure, for the purposes of this discussion: My name is Jonathan Sills. Don’t bother Googling – I am perhaps the least famous person with my name. (No, I’m not an executive with 1-800-Flowers.com, nor am I a university professor, nor…)
Online, I’m usually known as either Irish Wolf or Deacon Blues; the latter is quite popular, however, and in any randomly-selected Internet “location” it’s quite possible that’s not me. (Turned out “Irish Wolf” was taken in a few places, too – not as many, but there you go.) At the Champions Online forums, my handle is JonSills, which has the advantage of being easy to remember. At WrongPlanet.net, I’m known as DeaconBlues.
I first started using handles because, as noted above, back in the old days real names were actually discouraged – which seemed a bit odd to me, especially when the local BBSs would arrange parties and most of the people knew each other face-to-face, but they wanted handles, so I started off as Timmorn Yelloweyes (under which handle Blondi and I ran the Time Warp, a BBS in Omaha, NE in the mid-’80s). Since then, it just seemed kind of cute, as well as providing a certain level of protection for all those other Jonathan Sillses out there who might not want to get my emails. 🙂 However, I’ve never been afraid to own my opinions; who else would stand behind the poor things, after all?
One question, Ruben – would you place Asperger’s Syndrome in the blue ring, or the red ring? Just want to know how often I have to dodge darts… 🙂
Blue…Definitely Blue. As for how often you have to dodge darts…depends on how many people you pìšš øff on an average day.
A tip of the hat to you, Peter, for being a man of principle.
There are reasons to be anonymous, or mostly thus, and they’re not all intended to post with impunity or to hinder discourse.
I suppose if it weren’t for the trolls and nutjobs out in cyberland, I wouldn’t be so nervous about posting under my full name. I suppose if I didn’t have an uncommon name and was easily Googleable, especially now that I blog for work, I’d post under my full name. I suppose if not for my many years of experience posting on AOL writers boards and dealing with folks who routinely searched the other folks on the boards to try to dig up dirt on them and to aid in harassing them, I’d post under my full name. One woman who did who’s a teacher had one particular kook locate her school and send nasty letters to the principal about her sexual habits. I work in public service and didn’t need that kind of aggravation.
I suppose if I didn’t worry about identity theft, and watching what I said online to not reveal anything helpful to a thief should I post under my real name, I’d post under my full name.
I’ve thought about revealing all once I’m safely retired, but haven’t decided yet. Maybe if/when I sell my SF manuscript, I’d be so thrilled, I’ll shout my name online.
But not now. Not yet.
I prefer not to post under my real name simply because there are a lot of crazy people on the Internet, some of whom have threatened to kill Peter David at times. I just don’t want that kind of trouble for talking about my favourite comics and TV shows. Also, I don’t want my employers looking up my comments on FALLEN ANGEL #18 and using that to draw a picture of me professionally. That said, if I’m asked for my name, I would likely provide it, and I’ve never denied being “ireactions.”
I’m just not comfortable with it. But I don’t use my thin anonymity to be mean to people. If that lessens me in Peter David’s opinion, then, well, I suppose I must accept his criticism. I’d find it hard to disagree. But I just don’t think my personal safety and professional life are worth risking for some chatter over fiction.
I prefer not to post under my real name simply because there are a lot of crazy people on the Internet, some of whom have threatened to kill Peter David at times.
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There are?
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Well, THAT’S a thought that’s gonna fester now…
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PAD
http://www.peterdavid.net/index.php/2003/11/13/threats/
Yes. There are.
Oh, THAT idiot. He still goes around to this day trash-talking me on various boards. No threats of assaulting me at conventions, though.
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It should be noted, though, that his threats came as a result, not of anything I said anywhere on line, but because of an issue of “Supergirl” I wrote. So what should I do? Write stories under pen names lest I wind up pìššìņg øff someone and they come after me?
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Yes, I take threats seriously. Who shouldn’t? But I also take seriously the idea that I’m not going to let fear of random idiots deter me.
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PAD
As far as threats from pseudonymous commenters go, I’m one of those who routinely disagrees with you on politics… and at one Shore Leave, I presented you with “PAD Wallet Defense Squad” business cards and was ready to help keep you and your wallet safe from harm. Sorry my friend and I couldn’t have been there in Europe that time. You handled that quite fine, but it’s a shame that you had to deal with such riff-raff.
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J.
You know, what’s interesting is that in rereading those blog posts and the threats that originated in Comic Book Resources, people from CBR showed up here and insisted that I was being too hard in my assessment of the place and maintained I should give the chatboards a chance. And I did for a few years. During which time it became even more toxic, more hostile, and more unwelcoming until I finally just put the boards in my rearview. I still do the X-positions and occasionally comment on some of the blogs, but that’s pretty much it.
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PAD
Speaking of X-Positions, I see you’ve got one coming up. Often times the questions focus on “what’s next in X-Factor?” and while you seem to do your best to not just brush those aside, it’s understandably difficult to answer such questions in too much detail. So, what sorts of questions should readers be asking instead? Or, to put it another way, if you had a chance to ask Peter David a question in a forum like that, what would you ask?
I’ve always used my real name, maybe because my first exposure to the online world was via Prodigy, where you had to use your real name (come to think of it, I don’t think there’s ever been a better message board than those old Prodigy boards). Using an alias just makes me feel silly. On the other hand, I’ve used my real name on message boards on which almost everyone else was using an alias, and it kind of felt like the online equivalent of being naked in public, so I generally don’t do it anymore. Like, on the DC message boards I go by “hork,” which is the default user name I’ve been using for over 10 years.
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I guess it helps that I have a very common name (shared by, among many others, an old actor), and am therefore virtually unGoogleable. Not that I have anything to hide if I weren’t.
Putting your name out there does perhaps chill some of the G.I.F.T. inclinations. On the other hand, the reason that is true is presumably because of fears about reputation impact, and it’s perfectly possible to develop and care about your reputation even if it’s attached to a name that’s different from the one you were born with.
So I wouldn’t say it matters so much that it’s a “real” name, as long as it’s a name that the person cares about.
And that’s where, I think, Google has got it wrong with their policy of requiring real names only on Google+. There’s a whole lot of online persona-building that’s gone on in the course of the growth of the Internet – people who, for whatever reason, have cultivated an online identity tied to a name that doesn’t match their birth certificate. They shouldn’t have to switch to a mostly-unknown name just because it does.
Also, a comic book writer’s blog seems like an odd place to be dissing on secret identities. 🙂
Isn’t the problem less about people using real or fake names, and more that people need to learn to talk/post the same, regardless of if you’re using your real name. Basically, even if using a handle or nickname, you should post as if you’re in person or using your real name.
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That being said, I was raised to always take responsibility for my words, and own them, so I always post under my own name, with a real email address. I keep expecting to get a nasty email one day but it’s not happened yet.
I post here with my initials, but then I’ve only posted here a few times. On comic book sites I use a single alias – one I got years ago for the DC boards and which I maintain so that people can ‘recognise’ me from site to site. Personally I’ve never said anything under any of my usernames that I wouldn’t ultimately be willing to admit and own; I just prefer to keep the various identities separate if I can.
I think it’s important to emphasise that not everybody uses an alias to shoot their mouth off with a feeling of impunity. I won’t deny that a huge proportion of online posters do that, and I know all too well that certain forums are an absolute troll-pit when it comes to this behaviour, but alongside the trolls are people who simply want to keep their geeky online persona separate from their ‘real life’ one, either for specific professional or personal reasons or just because they’re of a naturally shy or compartmentalising disposition. There are also people who feel vulnerable to stalking and harassment, and therefore keep the sharing of their real name and other details to a minimum both online and offline. I don’t think this necessarily takes away from the validity of anything they may say under their ‘anonymous’ usernames.