Okay, folks: You’ve been asking me what I thought of various debuts. Below (with spoilers) find my thoughts on the season debuts of “Alias,” “Smallville,” “Angel” and “West Wing.”
ALIAS: A masterstroke. The problem with a series like “Alias” that depends on shocking turns of events is that by the third season, the twists seem to be there purely to be twists without adding any actual drama. Not on “Alias.” By jumping the series ahead two years and leaving its protagonist (and by extension the audience) playing catch-up, “Alias” maintains it’s at-least-one-gasp-per-fifteen-minutes pace. The maneuver through which she got her dad out of jail was a bit pat for my taste (they sign a letter kicking him loose? Great. They then say they wrote it under duress and rip it up) but the end sequence with Syd watching the videotape of herself was breathtaking. Was it really her? Or was it a duplicate, since we know that capability exists (just ask her dead friend.) And has Sloane really joined the side of the angels? Did two years of chasing after the pieces of the Rimbaldi machine really only result in the punchline from the song “One Tin Soldier?” See? Even the lame stuff is open to second-guessing.
SMALLVILLE: Gotta tell ya, the story’s not making tons of sense to me, and events in the series take us even further from the concept that this could possibly be the story of young Clark Kent who goes on to become Superman (not only would Lex Luthor recognize him, but now major crime players in Metropolis would be able to say, “Oh, yeah, Superman…used to work for me.”) We’re moving from the notion of guilty teen to the concept that Clark’s either under the control of the voice of Zod–I’m sorry, Jor-El–or maybe the ring, or maybe he’s just gone bonkers. On the other hand, Tom Welling is thriving on evil Clark, it was a kick to see Lex Luthor go completely Fight Club, and I’m still waiting for Chloe to start writing articles under the name “Lois Lane.” And Rutger Hauer! My God, how can you not love a TV series that could give us *weekly* (or at least recurring) doses of Rutger Hauer?
ANGEL: Joss Whedon’s season-opening episodes are generally among his weakest, but this was a happy exception. Eminently quotable dialogue and fascinating gray-area scenarios that’s like taking “The Practice” and running it through the horror genre grinder. My personal jury is still out on Gunn’s transformation into a lawyer. On the other hand, it was fun to see the old Cordelia reincarnated as Harmony: Much of her dialogue and all of her attitude could have been first season Cordy, right down to the turn-on-a-dime, “Oh, my poor friend, woe is me…oh well. Where were we?” And we’re going to have to wait a week to see which leaked rumor is true: That Spike is now a human and the first male slayer to boot, or that Spike is non-corporeal, i.e., a ghost. Plot hole that bothered me: How did Wesley know Spike? They’ve never met. Plot hole that stopped bothering me: How the hëll did they get the amulet from the bottom of the Sunnydale pit so they could mail it back to Angel? I realized that Willow could probably just wave her hand in some retrieval spell and the amulet would be in her hand. And thank God Angel got rid of that personal SWAT team: Any tactical group conducting a gunfight with a vampire during broad daylight that doesn’t think to shoot out the windows so sunlight would come cascading in, severely handicapping Angel, deserves what they get.
WEST WING: The Republicans-Aren’t-Automatically-Evil angle continues as the more politically-savvy Leo knows the GOP won’t do anything stupid while the less-experienced staffers keep cooking up worst case scenarios garnered from Democratic paranoia (which doesn’t mean the GOP *isn’t* out to get them…) The rescue of Zoe Bartlett was almost anti-climactic. I mean, I didn’t expect Bartlett to come swinging down on a rope from a helicopter, or Abby to stomp into a terrorist hideout armored in a power loader announcing, “Get away from her, you BÍTÇH!” Instead it’s an off-camera rescue by the FBI having something to do with a domestic dispute and dialing 911. I couldn’t quite figure it out. Still, the show remains watchable, I’ll be interested to see where they go from here, and the final sequence with Abby pointedly standing with her back to her husband on the TV rendered a powerful mute statement that the state of their matrimonial union has taken a serious hit.
Whew.
PAD
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Enterprise spoiler…
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You think those scans the concubine gave the Xindi were human or do you think she gave them T’Pol’s? I’m guessing T’Pols..
I thought ANGEL and ALIAS both started well, if not spectacularly. ANGEL’s writing was sharper than its direction (though I liked the epic tracking shot at the beginning of the show), and I especially enjoyed “Blondie Bear?” and Angel’s reaction to his new garage.
Where ALIAS is concerned, Sloane is _clearly_ B.S.ing about what the Rambaldi device revealed. Think about it: he’s proven in the past that he’s more than willing to sacrifice any short-term power he’s accrued (like running SD-6) for long-term gain. I’m betting that sinister prophecy from the end of last season set Sloane up for world dictatorship, and that his new nice-guy image is just a means to that end.
I’m also wondering if “Il Dire,” the grand Rambaldi device, didn’t somehow reorder the flow of time and shunt Syd into some alternate universe.
Or perhaps it’s a cloning device (remember, Sloane said he needed Jack Bristow for the device to work) and the Syd who woke up in that alley isn’t the Syd we’ve all known for the past two years?
**When is Lorne shooting his pilot for “Queer Eye of Newt for the Straight Vampyr”?
Posted by Pack @ 10/02/2003 01:50 PM ET**
Oh man, I’d totally watch that! :-p
I suppose the other reason for not worrying too much about Wes and Spike having met would be the scads and scads of non-onscreen time during which someone could have talked about Spike, mused about Spike, complained about Spike, got an annoying spam email from Spike, ran into Spike’s brother Snoopy…
Hey, wait a minute, Chekov wasn’t on TOS when Khan appeared…oops, they explained that in the novelization of ST:WoK.
Take care, Jon
In response to Mark Kalet’s question above, I’ve always heard that the guest star they couldn’t get was Juliet Landau, aka, Drusilla. Although she did appear on a handfull of episodes, they weren’t able to use her all the way through to the end of the season. They had originally intended to turn her into that season’s big bad. Unfortunately, she had prior commitments, and she was relegated to a minor supporting role in the Darla story.
First, let’s fix the font colour, huh?
>Regarding Angel, here’s one of those things that only car guys notice: When Angel goes down to the garage to select a ride from his new fleet (and I kinda hope we haven’t seen the last of his good old triple-black ’67 GTX ragtop), he passes up the first-generation Camaro SS, the early Mustang fastback, the black Viper and a couple of other sweet rides and selects the yellow ’70 Dodge Coronet with the funky black stripes that looks exactly like the one in the current Lee Jeans commercial with the action-cop-movie theme. I’m betting that’s the only car in the scene that the show actually owns, and we’ll never see him use any of the others.
Teeny-spoiler for 5.2 – after trying to get into the black Viper (you’ll see why he doesn’t), he starts driving away in the blue-grey one beside it, but we don’t see him driving it outside.
> And I figure the W&H folks have probably set Angel’s personal fleet up with black glass so he can drive in the daylight…
Actually – despite all the “necro-tempered” crap, does anyone ever remember glass-filtered sunlight being a problem for Buffyverse vamps before? I can think of plenty of occasions, running from Angel (Buffy 1.7) to Salvage where the light wasn’t a problem while the glass was there.
I’m not sure of the canonical status of the buffy comics and novels (and I’m way too lazy to read them all again just to find out) but I’m sure that Wes and Spike met in a comic and a novel and some point.
Anyone with a better memory know about this?
So Spike is dead and intangible. Wasn’t there some character on Buffy last year who could impersonate dead people albeit intangibly? Just a coincidence I’m sure.
In regards to Wesley knowing Spike, he was a Watcher and the Watcher’s council likely had pictures or artists renderings of Spike. They were well aware of his existence and he and Dru caused them quite a bit of trouble in the ’40s in one novel I read that was quite good by Christopher Golden.
I’m just curious if any Smallville devotees watched Angel for the first time (or vice-versa) and what did you think? Angel held on to most of the Smallville lead-in, so that’s good. I’m hoping the two shows can bolster each other a bit–they seemed geared toward similar tastes.
You know, I noticed that about Amy Ackerman. There were a lot of shots of her legs in the episode.
Not that I’m complaining.
STAR TREK: I turned off Enterprise right after the opening – Paramount has serious worries if a diehard Trekkie like myself is doing this.
WEST WING: Pretty dry, but at least the “evil Republicans” weren’t evil this week. If Sorkin had been writing it, the legislation would have been in the House and Senate within 12 hours of the Acting President assuming control. Much better balance on the political front, but the drama was weaker as well. I want to see that little French dude get the whipping from Jed that every father is entitled to!
ALIAS: Much more impressed with this year’s season premiere than last year’s. Last season, the show seemed to lose a great deal of the breakneck pace and momentum that the first season had, and I began to lose interest. We’ll see where this one’s going. Although, just like with ER, I’m a bit miffed that, after finally allowing the chemistry between Syd/Vaughn (or, with ER, Carter/Abby) to shine, the writers/producers feel almost obligated to break ’em up.
ENTERPRISE: (Or, as it’s now officially called, Star Trek: Enterprise.) I continue to watch it out of inertia. I’ve not lost any sleep over missing huge chunks of the episodes while fixing dinner. It faced the very real possibility of me no longer watching, with the WB’s rescheduling of Smallville, but since the hours of my wife’s new job won’t get her off of work until 7pm CST, I’ll already be taping Smallville for her, so I’ll watch Enterprise while I wait for her to get home. Oh…and I really don’t care for the new arrangement of the theme.
WEST WING: This week, I thought was a little weaker than the premiere. It seemed almost like there was suddenly a hurry to resolve the Zoey kidnapping/Bartlet steps down storyline. I did get a kick out of Josh’s new intern asking, “Do you guys always walk this fast?” during one of the trademark “walk & talk” scenes.
ANGEL: Loved it. Not much more to say. Some great lines, a lot of potential in the new direction. After I sat back and thought about it, Gunn’s decision made a lot of sense, given how last season he mentioned several times that he felt outclassed by the rest of the group.
SMALLVILLE: Haven’t watched the season premiere yet. It’s taped, so we’ll probably get to it tomorrow night.
Not to take a left turn, but why is “Enterprise” broken? I mean, I agree that it’s broken, but it’s not like they’re doing two series at once anymore (remember the generalized lack of quality when DS9 and VOY were running full tilt at the same time)? So why aren’t the people who have brought us so much great Trek in the past capable of taking the novel concept that is “Enterprise” and making her fly? It’s a dámņ shame, and I just don’t get it.
And while I’m here, let me plug my new favorite show, “Scrubs.” There’s some really smart, funny (and surprisingly good) stuff happening there every week… I think a lot of people are writing it off since it airs sammiched between the equally insipid “Friends” and “Will & Grace.” I would think fans of PAD would really love this show. If John C. McGinley doesn’t win an Emmy for Dr. Cox before the show ends its run, well, there’s just something wrong with the world.
The OTHER John Byrne
Never watched Alias or West Wing. Just never got around to it. Smallville….ah i’m sorry I just don’t get the appeal of this show. It’s so …bland and way too…. wholesome. And Clark and Lana are not just attractive, they are ‘glamorous model’ types. Even the Kents had to be slim and attractive.
Every talk with his parents has the “importantemotionaltalkwithparents!’ feel to it with the teary eyes and sad music. Yet when he hears Martha miscarried, Clark’s face barely even changed. It just takes itself so seriously every second of the times, it seems like “Parry of Five” with superpowers to me.
This whole “Jerk-Clark” is a weak Angelus rip-off and way too much of the Superman mythos is fragged up here. I never liked the notion that the ‘S’ symbol is Kryptonian. I also find it ridiculous that kryptonite would affect machinery now and yes, WHAT is the deal with Jor-El’s voice? (Not ‘Zor-El’ btw) They make it seem like he’s sitting behind a mike on another planet. They DO know he’s dead right? Lex is the only character I find even remotely interesting. And if ‘Chloe’ DOES turn out to be Lois Lane I’m definitely out of here. I guess I’m ‘too old-school for this sh*t’.
No offense to anyone. Tastes differ I guess.
‘Angel’ on the other hand was a delight. So much better written. Funny, sharp and fresh. Harmony, Spike, no Connor, great. And everyone’s befuddlement at the new surroundings, especially Angel’s. Loved it. And yes I too noticed Wes spotting Spike thought they never met. (And watch it again, he says it BEFORE Angel.) But he’s been with the Scoobies, and part of Team Angel for years now, so I doubt he doesn’t know who Spike is. And let’s face it, the description only needed to include “white blond” and “leather duster”. And Wes is a smart guy.
Really looking forward to next week and the rest of the season.
(“If you want to sacrifice a relative press….” Bwahahaha)
BrakYeller: So why aren’t the people who have brought us so much great Trek in the past capable of taking the novel concept that is “Enterprise” and making her fly? It’s a dámņ shame, and I just don’t get it.
Actually, I attribute DS9’s success to Ira Behr and Rober Wolfe (sp?). Yes, Berman was an EP on there, but they were clearly focused on Voyager at the time. Behr and Wolfe are no longer in the fold, so we get the lackluster team that brought us the squandered potential of Voyager. I’m still burned that Berman had the gall to say in interviews that Enterprise would be totally different than what we’ve seen before, and they didn’t want to just put another Captain in front of a veiwscreen. So instead they give us a Captain in front of a view screen and a trio of main characters that’s the Captain, The Vulcan, and the Southerner. And when ratings flag we bring in the Borg and Ferrengi and Klingons.
We have *never* seen any of that before…
/bitter, bitter threadjack
//You know, I noticed that about Amy Ackerman. There were a lot of shots of her legs in the episode.//
And yet none of you noticed her name is Amy Acker. Though you’re right, they did linger on her legs quite a bit. I guess she’s going to be called upon to carry all the sex appeal now that CC’s gone…
Angel: I think that W&H are more likely to have sent the amulet to Angel than one of the Scoobies. For what reason, I have no clue.
And I took the Wes knowing who Spike was as one of those things where Wes had been told about Spike before offscreen, like maybe sometime during his stay in Sunnydale during Season 3 of Buffy (especially since he was a Watcher then, and part of a Watcher’s job is knowing who your baddies are), and so he just put two and two. together. Grr..arg!
Can’t wait for episode 2! Spikey’s back!!! Yay, I’m as excited as Harmony!
remember the generalized lack of quality when DS9 and VOY were running full tilt at the same time
Nope.
As I recall it, during the period both shows were airing, DS9 kicked into high gear and was just plain outstanding.
Meanwhile, Voyager continued to squander potential and ignore itself week in and week out.
Of course, when TNG ended and VOY began, the production staff of TNG moved over to DS9 and the original DS9 production staff – responsible for the, to me anyway, lackluster first seasons – shifted over to the (then) new show. So, that might have something to do with it.
Did anyone else notice that Ben Edlund is a Supervising Producer for ANGEL? Could account for some of the humor! (Or has he always been on the show?)
As for ENTERPRISE, given the gravity of the situation (a species with technology from the future that can decimate mammoth amounts of land), you’d think they’d toss everything they have towards stopping it. And even if the Federation doesn’t have other warp-capable ships (did they say they’d have two ready at the start of season 3?), you’d think the Vulcans could be more helpful. Even if they’re afraid of the madness that happens in there, they could offer at least one ship to help.
Anyway, it feels like exploiting the fear of terrorism, and ratcheting up the gratituous t&a, at the sense of adventure and the founding of the Federation. (Remember when Archer’s decisions were foreshadowing of what the Federation would become? Now it’s how far he’ll break the rules to get more info.) Sad, just sad…
Even though Wesley never met Spike, I do think he would know who he is. Remember back in Buffy season five when the Watchers mentioned Spike? They were well aware of who he was. Considering he’s killed two Slayers (I think the only vamp to ever do so), it would make sense that all Watchers (even ones who have since been fired) would know who he is.
And dude, I never thought about shooting out the windows. But in my defense, I would have just said “to hëll with this” and walked out instead of trying to shoot him.
ANGEL: Quick note. The amulet belonged to Wolfram and Hart in the first place. Remember Lilah gave it to Angel to take to Buffy. I figure they are involved in its return. BTW, David Boreanaz has been gaining weight ever since he got married. Note Nicholas Brendon (Xander) also gained weight after he got married. Then again, who doesn’t? Sigh.
I like Superman, Superboy, Clark, Kal-El. At least, I like what always knew. Now, in the “Smallville” season opener, the “Superman to be”, teenager Clark Kent, is being portrayed as something he never was: A criminal. Such a past has never been a part of the young Superman’s life. Therefore, I conclude that this series is entirely happening in the “Twilight Zone”, “Outer Limits” or another such realm. We are the privileged witnesses of an alternate universe which mirrors the characters we know and love in a way that we never imagined because they are NOT those same people and those events never happened. Having come to this conclusion, I can actually enjoy the show for what it is:”NON REALITY TV.” WOW. For anyone who would dispute this, please read: Superman, “A man for all Seasons” by Jeph Loeb and artist Tim Sale. THIS is the true essense of young Superman (Clark) and should be a “must have” book for anyone. It’s a winner.
The intern asking Josh if they always walked that fast and then falling on his face was a great way of showing us that the new writers know they can’t match Sorkin’s skill on such scenes.
Wasn’t the opening of Angel sort of spoof of the opening of season 1? The action was over the top but the comment to the vamp seemed to be the same. Or maybe I’m suffering from deja voodoo. At first I thought it was going to turn out to be a TV ad for the “new” Wolfram and Hart.
Well, the thought crossed my mind about how the first show of every season is just a warm up until the things rev up to speed from over the summer….what if this was no different?
Maybe this was a “slow” episode and things only get better from here?
two things pop into my head about the amulet…
#1 I kinda assumed that Buffy was just following up on her usual business of sending Angel powerful artifacts for him to use or keep safe….It’s my guess that they didn’t know that Spike was going to come out of the amulet or was anything else but vamp dust.
#2 maybe the amulet had some kind of mystic SASE thing going for it?
I’m sure wolfram and hart have ways of recovering lent items and the like.
Maybe it conjured itself into that envelope or drew/duped someone else into sending it back where it “belonged”.
once back to it’s “owner” it released spike into W&H’s “care”.
I thought Harmony an annoying vampire and was glad she left.
HOWEVER, she seemed to fit in this episode. I hope she sticks around as a guest star but doesn’t get overplayed.
I liked almost everything in the show and sadly I hardly missed Cordelia.
I liked the new intro and cheered when they did spike’s intro, Harmony was a nice surprise because I either missed her name in the credits or maybe it wasn’t there….
Speaking of the credits, I had noticed the name of ben edlund before in the credits but I was never sure whether it was THE Ben Edlund or just someone else with the same name.
Holy cow, if you guys don’t write a lot of responses!
Of course, I only noticed because I read them all.
Geez. (pseudo-spoilers follow)
Well, I had a pretty open mind about ANGEL‘s first episode this season; mostly I just wanted to see what they could do with what they’d done and not presume anything.
That worked pretty well; I thought it was really fun and funny and yadda yadda scooby-dooby-doo. Gunn’s twist was interesting, Fred’s manic episodes and love/hate thing with her co-workers, Lorn’s all in and over and about it (but that’s Lorn), and Angel seemed thrown off-balance and conflicted at first but seems to be sparking some kind of plan on how he wants to, you know, do… something.
Oh, yeah, and I agree with the whole Harmony-was-annoying-on-Buffy-but-so far-an-interesting-touch-here comment.
Everything’s still kinda up for grabs; nothing really disappointed me. I just want to see where it’s going… Oh, and dámņëd if this isn’t an example of how “open-minded” I was about this episode: I was excited to see spike in the credits and then *poof* I let myself get so caught up in what was going down that I was surprised to see him at the end. : P
Yes, I’m a psycho.
…and SPIKE doesn’t deserve a capital letter, i guess.
Did anyone else notice that the mob boss’s son was not allowed to read the Punisher. Just curious if he was not allowed due to violence or the target of said violence (mobsters/mafia types). Maybe I’m reading too much into it, or it was a cool little side joke by Whedon
Question:
On Smallville – does Clark remember what he does while under the influence of red k?
Observation:
Boy, was I wrong about how they would bring Spike back on Angel —
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A ghost??!!!?? Feeeh!
The only one of the four shows that I saw was West Wing, but I don’t seem to be as disappointed with it as many of the folks who saw it. (Gretchen, however, complains that if the lighting gets any worse, she’s going to be unable to follow it at all.)
I’m not surprised that we didn’t get as much snappy patter in talking and walking in these two episodes as was normal before. Given the situation, snappy patter wasn’t really called for. Let’s see what happens when the White House is no longer the absolute emotional mess that it was for the first two weeks of the season.
If you complain that Will’s speech was uninspired, consider that we heard far more of it than we heard of most of Bartlet’s speeches — at least in the two seasons that I’ve seen so far. It’s easier to come up with a few grabber lines and fade out than it is to write a longer coherent piece. And I’m starting to suspect — based more on intuition than anything else — that one of Will’s functions on the show is to teach Toby how to be just optimistic enough that his ex-wife might take him back.
I understood the rescue scene and why it was played the way it was. You can’t show the actual rescue, because it will give too many clues as to whether Zoey survived. (I’m convinced that her death would have been ratings poison, so I was pretty sure she’d live through the process, but might be badly injured.) The discussion between Leo and the agent on the scene described pretty accurately what had happened. (It also described it in the brisk snappy patter that folks are complaining about the absence of.) So let’s roll it back (from memory):
The FBI office got a tip from someone who thought they had info on the kidnapping. The Feds scouted the location and decided to go in. There were three kidnappers, one of whom was asleep. They went in with “flashbangs”, weapons that are designed to disorient and stun the victim but not kill outright. I’m not clear on whether there were any survivors among the kidnappers, but I don’t think so, although the fellow who was asleep may have survived. Zoey was tucked in a closet and had been beaten, but not sexually molested.
That’s on one viewing without rolling the video tape back — and I’ve got to say that I’ve had to do that in the past for some of Sorkin’s dialogue to figure out what’s going on, so…
I don’t recall a reference to Zoey’s cellphone, but I may have missed it. And as I said, I didn’t roll the tape back.
Bill Roper writes (about West Wing):
So let’s roll it back (from memory):
The FBI office got a tip from someone who thought they had info on the kidnapping. The Feds scouted the location and decided to go in. There were three kidnappers, one of whom was asleep. They went in with “flashbangs”, weapons that are designed to disorient and stun the victim but not kill outright. I’m not clear on whether there were any survivors among the kidnappers, but I don’t think so, although the fellow who was asleep may have survived. Zoey was tucked in a closet and had been beaten, but not sexually molested.
That’s on one viewing without rolling the video tape back — and I’ve got to say that I’ve had to do that in the past for some of Sorkin’s dialogue to figure out what’s going on, so…
I don’t recall a reference to Zoey’s cellphone, but I may have missed it. And as I said, I didn’t roll the tape back.
I also didn’t rewatch the episode, but I do recall a reference to a cellphone, but not that it was necessarily Zoe’s. The tip that the FBI reacted to, I think, was phoned in on a cellphone, but I don’t recall if it was Zoe’s, or some passerby’s, or one of the kidnapper’s, or whoever’s.
I mentioned this on another thread here (so forgive me if I’m repetitive) but although one could certainly say that this episode’s ending could have been better executed, I suspect that some of the ambiguity is on purpose.
In last season’s finale, Nancy opined that the kidnapping didn’t sound like the work of organized terrorists. Zoey was found locally–not tied to a chair in a cargo shack somewhere in the middle of Uganda (the nightmare scenario Bartlett told Zoey in an earlier episode.) Will asks whether they were ever able to find those missing terrorist sleepers (which might mean “Are those guys who did this still at large?” but also might mean “Were those guys even involved?”) All of that might be purposeful ambiguity to get viewers to wonder things like, “Hey, what if they bombed people who, though bad guys, didn’t have anything to do with this kidnapping?”
What exactly transpired might well get further explained in future episodes. But for right now, I can see how the situation’s ambiguity might be by the creators’ design.
Wouldn’t it be kewl if the voice from Clark’s rocket DID turn out to be from ZOD, who tampered with it before it left Krypton? Why else would “Jor El” want his son to conquer Earth? A worthy future season ender: Zod appears pretending to be Jor-El and looking for Clark to see if his mind-f@%k on him worked.
Can’t be, although it would have made sense (and what I’m sure they were planning on doing). I read a while ago (in Wizard, I think) that the SMALLVILLE folks were given an edict to not use Zod because of some tie to the new Superman movie or somesuch garbage.
And, in regards to ALIAS: Marshall, a father? I’m sure there are more than a few hardcore computer geeks (and I know some of them) who have been thanking the good lord that it happened; if Marshall could get some nookie, what says they can’t? 😉
-eD
I really, really, really miss Cordelia. I’ve been watching Angel since the first episode and the show the other night just didn’t seem right without her. A big mistake I think. Fred can’t carry the lead actress alone, Eve is annoying and I like Harmony but she seems like a Cordy clone.
James Lynch says:
Did anyone else notice that Ben Edlund is a Supervising Producer for ANGEL? Could account for some of the humor! (Or has he always been on the show?)
Ben Edlund (and yes, it is THE Ben Edlund of THE TICK fame) came onto the ANGEL staff at midseason last year. He was on the FIREFLY staff and made the move over after that show was cancelled several years ahead of its time. He wrote one of the best episodes last season, “Sacrifice.” His next episode as a writer will be the one coming up this week.
Oh, and incidentally, Edlund and Joss Whedon both did passes on the screenplay for TITAN A.E., so I assume that’s how they met.
Hi. Longtime reader – of PAD, first via The Incredible Hulk – recent discoverer of this site (and relative internet rookie). And how cool it was to find that not only did Peter David have a fan interaction site – but that he talked about Buffy T.V.S. and Angel on it! And West Wing, too!
About West Wing – having a hard time looking at it without thinking about Sorkin’s absence; but, trying to ignore second-guessing, it’s been pretty well-done. A little more than midway through, I realized I was getting quite caught up in it. (And when the President, First Lady, etc. were flying in, the thought occurred – I hope this really is Zoey they’ve found. That would have been awful.) (You would assume they had enough photos of her to be sure, but it does seem like what was said is “They think they’ve found her.) The scenes with the intern were funny, especially in the hallway, and hopefully indicitive of the style to come. Like everyone else, I’m unclear who the FBI tipster was – how does a domestic distrurbance call lead to Zoey’s kidnappers (was the caller the wife/girlfriend of one of the terrorists?)? – and I did think the President’s speech might have been more profound, or at least eloquent, with Sorkin writing it, but …. All in all, a solid hour, and so far the series, while perhaps different and certainly at least somewhat lessened for the loss of its main (teleplay-wise, basically only) voice, it doesn’t seem like it will go the way of Picket Fences – Good Lord, did that show fall apart after David E. Kelley left it.
And Angel … I was ecstatic. Buffy the Vampire Slayer had become my favorite show, and Angel an ever-closer second. And once again, I thought Joss Whedon knocked it clear out of the park (so to speak, seasonally appropriately). A direction for every character (well, except Spike, but we’ll give him a minute to acclimate to no longer burning to ash from the focused redeeming flames of his soul) – liked the little scene with Lorne screening the employees, actually getting to use his gifts again. (And his notepad is kind of funny, too, though you need to be able to pause it to read it.) And the humor – HA! Angel with the cars (which reminded me of the pilot ep, when, in a parking garage, he lept into the wrong car – a scene which David Boreanaz cited in a post-season four interview as the kind of humor he hoped the show would be getting back to in the coming year), Harmony at her best … I’ll doubtlessly miss some noteworthy moments, there were so many …. The opening sequence, of course, with the woman saying You did this for publicity? and Angel responding “No, I … help the helpless …” And that telephone system gave me the biggest laugh I’ve had all week.
As far as Wesley and Spike … it bothered me that Giles had to look him up in the first place. Of course, in “Fool for Love”, Buffy and Giles were lamenting the lack of detail regarding the deaths of former slayers. Maybe the Watcher’s Council didn’t feel like publicizing past “failures” and kind of swept this under the rug. It’s certainly not like they were perfect (I know I wasn’t the only one who felt like cheering when The First [through Caleb] blew them up. [Or was it Giles?:) Poor Anya.])…. But when Spike and Drusilla surfaced in Sunnydale, menacing the current Slayer, they became a prime topic at the Watchers Academy. (Current Events class?) If not in time for Wesley to be well-versed, this would at least give the young female Watcher time – three years after Buffy first met Spike – to have written her thesis on him. And Wesley’s stint in Sunnydale and certainly with Angel – with his prior “family reunions”- would have given him some chance to be familiar with “William the Bloody”. (Which, come to think, is what Faith-in-Buffy’s body called him back in Buffy Season Four, so clearly Spike has come up even when he’s not around.) Why did he recognize him on sight? (Okay, Faith didn’t… her encounter wasn’t in such a blatantly supernatural context, though, and it’s unlikely she learned much about Spike through study – not big on the books, she’s the first to say.) Well, besides his above-mentioned distinct appearance – maybe Wesley saw a photo of him, since we know now that vampires do show up on film:)(Oh geez – you don’t suppose they saw “Buffy: Slayer of the Vampyr”, do you?)
Yow, this ended up being a long post. Sorry. Anyway, thank you for the website, Peter/Mr.David/PAD (Should I call you “Mr. Peter David?” [old Saturday Night Live joke]); be reading you.
The thing that shocked me most about the Angel episode was the fact that Angel killed two human beings. We know from the episode “Darla” in Season 2 that Angel killed, and fed from, rapists and murderers for a time after he was ensouled while trying to get back in to Darla’s good graces, but as far as I’m aware this episode was the first time we’ve ever seen an ensouled Angel deliberately kill humans.
No Whedonverse hero has killed a human being without it being a big deal and having ramifications that extended for a long time after from Willow and Warren, Faith and the Deputy Mayor, or Gunn and Fred’s old Professor. Giles’ killing of Ben was the only one I can remember that didn’t evolve into a major plot point, and I always assumed that it would have if ASH hadn’t chosen to leave the show as a full time actor.
Has Angel been corrupted so quickly? It was all done so glibly though that I got the feeling that it will never be mentioned or addressed.
That said I loved the episode.
I refuse to watch gorefests like “Angel,” and “The West Wing” just reminds me that the fictional resident of the show’s White House is so much better than the real one.
But Smallville…it’s the only show I watch regularly in prime time. And although the plot twists are going into unusual places that are making hardcore comic book fans freak, it’s a worthy trip for the rest of us.
And watching the opening credits with the conspicuous, welcome credit for Siegel and Schuster, I thought about another great comic book creator. I also thought of that man when I saw this show’s version of Morgan Edge – I’m not sure, but wasn’t he created by Jack Kirby for the “Jimmy Olson” comics he did for DC?
Anyway, Kirby came to mind, and I wondered. What if that isn’t the voice of Jor-El or General Zod? What if it’s…DARKSEID???
If so, I hope they have the decency to add Kirby’s name to the credits somewhere.
Smallville:
I’m really diggin’ the show and I’m not trying to be pesimistic, but for all those people wondering and worring what going to happen when Clark dons the cape, let’s face it, the show’s probuly not going to run that long anyway.
Just admit this is a complete “Elseworlds” and enjoy the show. Once I stopped worrying all the little things I thought it was a great season opener.
Where to start? lol….
Angel-You all keep mentioning how they’re sexing up Fred but I find Mercedes McNab very sexy. I loved the dialogue,especially the phone thing Angel went thru. Did noone notice that at the opening, the lawyer had the rescued woman sign something concerning her eternal soul?
Smallville-Getting better and better. The only thing I hope is that Chloe doesn’t have to cry all season this year. Oh and maybe it’s not Zod or Darkseid. Maybe it’s Braniac.
Enterprise-T’Pal is finally looking sexy and all, the plot is ok…but my favorite character is getting left behind. Hoshi!Though I still loved the episode with Merriwether’s family.
Alias I’ve never liked since the first episode. She got all blubbery because the agency kills her boyfriend because she told him she’s a spy? Shouldn’t she know that’s a possibility before she tells him? Melissa George may lure me into watching an episode or two.
West Wing-A local channel is now playing the first season in syndication and I watched the first two episodes last weekend. Not bad at all. I may watch more of the reruns.
My big question is:What does everyone(especially PAD since it’s his site) think of the new shows coming on?Anyone enjoying any of them?
This is why fall is my favorite season 🙂
Michael Norton
Angel is a gore fest?
I’d like to get your impression on House of a thousand Corpses then 🙂
I don’t see the attraction men find to Harmony. Of course I find stupid women to be a MAJOR turnoff. Maybe that’s why I can’t stand her. I don’t care how good she looks. Probably why I never dug Cordy too much, but Willow…there’s another story.
I agree with Angel killing humans. It seems weird that he’s offing regular….well not regular regular, but you know what I mean.
What’s all this about Fred being the one with all the sex appeal now that Cordy’s gone? Didn’t she already have it?
Let’s see:
Smart and slightly crazy
vs.
Attractive, but dumb.
Anyone who’d choose the second… well, deserves what they get.
I always dug Willow more than Buffy or Cordelia. And smart-and-a-little-crazy wins over cute-but-dumb any day in my book.
Paul
Alias–loved it! This is such a GREAT series. I recently saw all Alias Season 1 on dvd & for the first time and loved it. Wow. What a series. I missed most of season 2, but I saw the last three, so I decided to go ahead and watch this season! Glad I did. The opener was brillant.
Smallville–Again, loved it. This is the best Smallville season opener yet, imo. I think this will prob be the best season yet (Season 3! IT fits. The 3rd season is usually where a sci-fi or fantasy show picks up)
Angel—Wow. What a change. It was good, not great. The set-up has a lot of potential for greatness though. Harmony was a blast, I like Eve already, not sure about Lawyer Gunn, liked Wes & etc, and the ending was cool. Can’t wait till next week!
West Wing—First one was good. Second one was too. A bit let down by the whole rescue. They should have shown it on screen. Otherwise, good show.
Enterprise so far—Two good episodes (the first 2), and one episode I had a hard time even sitting through. Have not seen the episode this week. I like the show, but so far some of the ‘new direction’ reminds me a bit of Voyager. *sigh*
DF2506
S2 of Smallville was a real disappointment to me. Too many stupid continuity problems.
For example, Lex bought the plant three different ways. He put in 90% himself in cash, and got 10% from the plant’s managers (Tempest), he got investors to foot 100% of the bill (Suspect), and he got a mortgage and used his personal assets as collateral (Prodigal). Now, completely aside from the fact that those three things are inconsistent, *and* that if Lex could make the plant profitable in about 6 months, he would know that one holds on to at least 50.1% of the shares in one’s company, (a) the plant itself should have been collateral for the loan, and (b) one incorporates *to protect one’s personal assets should the company go belly-up.*
This was just too stressful to watch, though I continued to follow the show through the eyes of my friends who still watched.
I have to say, on the topic of why Clark went “bad” this summer, that of course he had to. In DCU canon, Clark continually credits Superman’s ability to give second, third, fourth, etc., chances to Jonathan. But SV!Jonathan’s such a judgmental (expletive deleted), that the only way Clark could be willing to give felons the benefit of the doubt is because he’s walked a mile in their shoes.
JMHO.
2 little notes (on Angel) – I’d assume sun through glass is a problem since Spike spraypainted the windows on his car, and why draw attention to yourself during a vulnerable period (day) for no reason?
And, all the discussion of whether Wes would know of Spike – you can’t base what Wes as a Watcher would know on what Giles as a Watcher would know. Giles is older and the Council changed between his time and Wesleys. Also, Giles was ALWAYS out of the loop. He’d know little things, like Dru being attacked by a mob but not about Angel or Spike or many other baddies.
> The thing that shocked me most about the Angel episode was the fact that Angel killed two human beings. We know from the episode “Darla” in Season 2 that Angel killed, and fed from, rapists and murderers for a time after he was ensouled while trying to get back in to Darla’s good graces, but as far as I’m aware this episode was the first time we’ve ever seen an ensouled Angel deliberately kill humans.
Well there was the flashback in “Orpheus,” where he fed on the savable victim of a shooting. Then again, he spent 20 years in alleys feeding on rats after that…
He’s killed human beings who were trying to kill him before. (For that matter, so has Buffy. She iced several of the Knights of Byzantium in season 5.) And he’s left people on several occasions because they pìššëd him off. He just hasn’t killed and fed off any humans.
PAD
Great opening episode of Angel. I find myself wanting to write down lines of dialogue when I watch this show!
Oh, and the intercom’s Ritual Sacrifices line? Made me think I was back working at the IRS…
So is it just me or does anyone else think that Spike might actually be The First seeing that he’s intangible and dead? It seems a hëll of a lot more likely that Wolfram and Hart might have some type of interest in capturing or rescuing The First Evil than in assisting Angel in helping out his ex-girlfriend as a perk. W&H showed some interest in stopping Big Bads last year on Angel to maintain the status quo and in general self defense and they probably have the resources to retrieve the amulet from whatever demon dimension it was in. Plus, the First seemed to have some significant interest in messing with Angel’s head when he originally showed up and I expect Spike (or “Spike”) to be doing much of the same thing.
Angel-You all keep mentioning how they’re sexing up Fred but I find Mercedes McNab very sexy. I loved the dialogue,especially the phone thing Angel went thru. Did noone notice that at the opening, the lawyer had the rescued woman sign something concerning her eternal soul?
I don’t know if “all” are mentioning this. I know I did. Mercedes McNab is a lovely woman but what I meant was the way Amy Acker was dressed and in one scene, there was a shot that seemed to so gratuitously focus on her legs that it actually took me out of the story while I wondered, “What the hëll was *that* all about…?”
It’s not that Acker isn’t attractive or shouldn’t look good on the show but it doesn’t match up with the character as we’ve seen her over the last few years. That’s okay, people, like characters, change, I just though it was worth a comment.
To all those who bravely, nobly commented on how they prefered smart and cute to dumb and sexy, I promise that your wives, girlfriends, etc. are much more likely to give your pair back if you quit the Alan Alda-like lying and be men.
Last, a thought I had about Gunn after reading all the comments here: In retrospect, his transformation seems to be an obvious and necessary development for the series. Angel’s gang took over a law firm. Anyone believe they could take over a hospital without any doctors or health care professionals in their ranks? Making Gunn a lawyer gives the gang an absolutely required in to the law firm they’re controlling. (Although if this was a David E. Kelley show, it would have been revealed that Lorn had a law degree and was a member of the bar but had never told anyone…)