February 14, 1992
About six years ago, when the Canadian team called “Alpha Flight” first debuted in its own title (and quite a hot property it was at the time), there was a character named Northstar. And there were little, between-the-lines hints dropped by writer/artist John Byrne that Northstar was gay.
But in those days, overt portrayals of sexuality were considered a no-no. It wasn’t just limited to homosexuality, either. Over at DC, “Titans” unwed lovers Ðìçk Grayson and Koriand’r were shown in bed together, but at Marvel a similar scene between the married Bruce and Betty Banner was nixed.
As for homosexuality…forget it. The only overt portrayal of gay men in Marvel’s history had been the homosexual near-rape of Bruce Banner in a shower at a YMCA, lovingly depicted in the pages of the “Hulk” magazine. Since Marvel’s first portrayal of gay men came across as homophobic in nature, it was not a sequence that did much for Marvel, gays, Bruce Banner, or, for that matter, your local “Y.”
As for Northstar, well…for a while there, he was actually dying of AIDs, and that the fact that he was gay was going to be dealt with. It was dealt with, all right: The storyline was altered midway by a decree from upstairs. The declaration was subsequently made that Northstar was, in fact, a magical being, and was dying because he was away from his magical homeland for too long. Yes, that’s right…he wasn’t gay. He was just a fairy. That’s muuuuch better. And the protectors of superheroic masculinity breathed a sigh of relief. That was a close one.
But times, as they say, have changed.
The news wires have been burning up the past week as, in the pages of “Alpha Flight” #106, writer Scott Lobdell (with the full support of editor Bobbie Chase and editor-in-chief Tom DeFalco) did away with the sly winks and nudges, and had Northstar hold a press conference in which he came out as being gay. (Or, as one news reporter rather cattily put it, and here you thought comic books were something that were kept exclusively in closets.)
It was, of course, a terrific news story. Over at DC, where sexuality had been an open topic for quite some time, they must have been gnashing their teeth. The Pied Piper casually informed Wally West that he, the Piper, was gay, and then there’s the supporting cast over in “Sandman.” But none of this caused the sort of stir that Northstar’s revelation did.
Why? Because Northstar’s a hero, of course. Not only that, but an eminently macho superhero, although I must admit I have trouble relating the beefed-up steroid case rendered by artists Mark Pacella and Dan Panosian to the sleek, limber character first drawn by John Byrne. The Piper doesn’t seem remotely macho. Hëll, you could even make jokes about how he goes around blowing on long, narrow instruments, and that should’ve been the tip off right there.
It’s the same sort of reaction generated when Rock Hudson or Magic Johnson went public about AIDs. When AIDs was just a dark, loathsome disease that only “homos” got, society felt it easier to deal with. It barely warranted funds to try and cure it. But when the “good guys” got it, well, that was something else altogether.
(Although, on a side-note, I’ve wondered what the reaction would have been if, in fact, it had been Magic Johnson’s wife who had turned up HIV positive, sleeping around while her husband was out on the road. Would she have had books written about her called “The Heroism of Mrs. Magic?” Or would she have been pilloried as being a šlûŧ? But that’s a whole ‘nother discussion in itself.)
So there was Northstar, making startling personal revelations in the middle of a slugfest (which is the customary way that heroes make such disclosures.) For those of you who haven’t read it, the story actually doesn’t center around Northstar’s sexuality, but rather around an abandoned newborn whom Northstar finds in a garbage can. He brings the scrawny infant to a hospital, drawn at times to look like a gymnasium, or perhaps a vacant parking garage…anything but a hospital. (The single stick of furniture in the place is the incubator that the baby’s kept in, standing alone, like the Cheese, in an otherwise empty room large enough to field a basketball game.)
Tests reveal the child has AIDs, and the terminal infant’s plight becomes a cause celebre…except to one retired Canadian hero who’s in-jokingly named Major Mapleleaf (after the sarcastic nickname Banshee gave Vindicator upon his first appearance). Apparently the Major’s son died of AIDs, but “because he was gay, he didn’t rate.” Society’s cavalier attitude that gays brought AIDs upon themselves and, therefore, did not deserve sympathy, has stuck in the Major’s craw for years.
Rather than seek therapy, the Major misplaces his aggression on Northstar, the fight ranging through a supermarket and winding up smashing into a moving van apparently owned by editor Chase. In the course of the battle, Northstar reveals that he himself is gay, gets lectured about being a hypocrite (while being strangled; a sure way to drive home a point) and, once the dust clears, goes public.
Oh, and as if to assure us that all is “right,” the final image in the comic is a pin-up featuring Logan, Puck and Northstar (I think it’s Northstar. The way he’s drawn, it might also be Ðìçk Tracy) cutting up and being macho guys in a bar, each of them chugalugging what appear to be entire pitchers of beer.) To be fair…it could be a gay bar. Who knows?
It was, as noted earlier, the ideal news story, in our world as much as the Marvel universe. Reporters love stories that can be boiled down to ten words or less. “A Super-Hero announces he’s gay! Film at 11!” For some reason I imagined people turning to each other and saying, “I knew it! I knew there was some reason Batman kept hanging out with that kid!” How disappointed the vast majority of Americans must have been to learn it was a super-hero they’d never even heard of.
Not only that, but since “Alpha Flight” is direct-only (a fact that none of the news stories I happened upon ever pointed out) the chances are that Joe Average wouldn’t be able to find it. Anyone who’s interest is piqued enough to try and seek out a copy would go down to his local 7-11, be told by the guy behind the counter that they’d never heard of “Alpha Flight,” and perhaps presume the whole thing was a hoax.
But the question now becomes: What happens next?
Well, frankly, what’s happened up until now hasn’t been tremendously heartening.
Initial news reports stated that Marvel was offering “No Comment” on their groundbreaking publication. One reporter described Marvel reps as “skittish.” No one could, or would, talk for attribution.
The message being delivered to the American public was clear. Someone high up, probably very high up (certainly higher than DeFalco) was extremely embarrassed by the story. Here various news agencies were ready to heap praise upon Marvel for daring storytelling, and the silence of Marvel’s response was positively ringing. Not only did Marvel Corporate not seem proud of their achievement, but instead they came across as hoping that it would all die down very quickly.
Eventually a wire service story ran that quoted Marvel reps, but by then it was too late. Rather than seizing the bull by the horns, Marvel had instead let itself get a bit gored by puzzled reporters who couldn’t get a quote.
Ah, but what of Scott Lobdell, the gutsy storyteller?
Oh him. He’s off the book.
Now I would love to be able to break the story here of how, in retaliation for writing an embarrassing story, Scott was fired. That, however, is not the case. (Indeed, if it were the case, I’d have put it a lot further up in this column…like, in the lead sentence. “Marvel writer fired for having Northstar come out of closet. Film at 11.”)
No, Scott’s departure occurred a week or so before the brouhaha hit. With Bobbie Chase taking on new editorial assignments (but still holding onto the “Hulk,” God bless her) “Alpha Flight” was switched to another editor, and that editor took Scott off the title and reassigned it, for reasons (according to Scott) having nothing to do with the Northstar story. It is certainly not the first time that a new editor has come on and put new creative personnel on a title. However, this particular instance has got to go down in the record books as being one of the most ill-timed such maneuvers in the history of comics.
(For what it’s worth, I think a truly professional comic editor is one who is assigned a title and has no other agenda than to make sure good stories are told. Sitting down with a writer and saying, “This story doesn’t work for this and this a reason, relating to dramatic structure…” is absolutely proper. To sit down with a writer and say, “You’re doing Story Type X, but I don’t want to see that, I want to see Story Type Y, so adios…” shows a lack of being able to delegate creative authority. It boils down to “I want to see this book done the way I would do it if I were writing it.” That does no service to anyone except an editor who wants to feel totally in charge.)
The question of Northstar’s coming out ultimately, then, boils down to this: What next?
It could easily be argued that this was a simple step in Northstar’s development, and that the enlightened approach would be not to dwell on it any more than finding out that a casual acquaintance is gay.
However, we do not live in an enlightened society when it comes to homosexuality (witness Marvel’s own reaction). Besides, casual acquaintances don’t call press conferences announcing their sexuality, offering it up as a way of countering homophobia. No, now that Northstar’s made the declaration with a stated agenda, it would be unrealistic not to examine the fallout. (And no, I’m not pitching to write “Alpha Flight.” I’m more than busy enough, thank you very much.)
Northstar is a media figure, and sure to become even more so. Will lovers of his who may not want to risk being high profile now shun him? For that matter, let’s say you’re a friend of his who’s straight. How will you feel if your picture is snapped with him in a restaurant and run in a newspaper with the caption, “Northstar and his latest paramour?” Will you take it in stride, laugh it off? Or will you resent the intrusion…perhaps even resent Northstar?
For that matter, can you imagine Northstar fighting a villain who tauntingly shouts, “Look out! Here comes Canada’s fighting fág!” Or even better…a villain who automatically assumes that, since Northstar is gay, he probably has AIDs…and surrenders on the spot rather than risk getting into a fistfight? How would such a “victory” make Northstar feel?
Then there’s the guy who gets the snot kicked out of him by a group of gay bashers…and goes to Northstar, asking him to go out and beat up the gay bashers because homosexuals shouldn’t have to suffer like this. Would Northstar consider it inappropriate to use his powers against mere mortals for the purpose of vengeance? Or would he consider it only fair since the gay bashers have no qualms about ganging up on one gay man?
Possibilities, all sorts of possibilities, which it would almost criminal to ignore. A far cry from the generic “Villain shows up, fights hero, hero ultimately wins, the end.” But will Marvel and the new writer and editor pursue those directions? Will there be pressure never to mention Northstar’s sexual identity again?
“Alpha Flight” could be pretty darn interesting, depending how things go, and if the seeds that Scott Lobdell has sown are brought to…you should pardon the expression…fruit. A pity that the vagaries of editorial life have dictated he won’t be there to do the gardening. Shed no tears for him; he’s got other assignments coming up that should also be quite high-profile. Although I doubt that CNN will be calling him to find out about them.
If nothing else, he’ll have some impressive clippings for his scrapbook. And Northstar will have…well…who knows?
(By way of the promised update, Peter David, writer of stuff, can now play all the way through “Dragons Lair II: Time Warp,” making this the third Don Bluth animated game he’s gotten the hang of. The ending sequences are really touching, by the way.)
• 
You can find out about LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgendered) characters at:
http://www.gayleague.com/gay/characters/index.php
You can find out about LGBT creators at http://www.prismcomics.org
Also – You know what’s a REALLY inflammatory site?
check out http://www.godhatesfigs.com
Thats right, I said FIGS!
Peter:
You are a lying liar who tells only lies! NO ONE in human history has ever finished “Dragon’s Lair II: Time Warp”! That game was and remains friggin’ IMPOSSIBLE. Anyone who says so is clearly either delusional or lying. Admit it: you did the same thing I did and mucked around with the home edition until you could get it to play the movie files, just to admire the wonderful way Bluth and company render Daphne.
You know it’s true.
Paul 🙂
I’ve read de Alpha Flight series of Steven T.Seagle and I didn’t like it, I didn’t like Scott Clark work, but Duncan Rouleau made me wish Scott to come back. I suppose Seagle knew Marvel was going to cancel the book, so he could end the conspiracy a few issues earlier.
And Dragon’s Lair’s good, but Space Ace is better
Wilt wrote: Or maybe his intent was to say that anyone who is not actively trying to be the best that the can be is not heroic. If one is actively involved in a sinful or less than perfect lifestyle, regardless of what the sin is, and is boastful about, there is no heroism involved.
If that was his intent, there is no inconsistent stance there.
Fair enough. There’s no inconsistency there. It’s still a wrongheaded stance, I think, but the inconsistency of it is open to debate.
Bladestar wrote: By your continual support for an áššhølë president that seeks to legislate his ignorant religion into law.
You are less than human by your total lack of respect for others.
You call my religion ignorant, then accuse others of a lack of respect, Bladestar?
By the way, how, exactly, is Bush trying to legislate his religion into law? Be specific here. Which proposed legislation are you protesting, and exactly how is it a legislation of the Christian faith?
Jeff Lawson said: DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS.
Awww, phooey. You just don’t want me to have any fun. (Trolls feed on anger, right? So, if I’m trying to use trollishness to springboard a rationsl conversation, is that still feeding the trolls?)
You reeally are that stupid, eh Robin?
Try the proposed amendment to to Ban Gay Marriage for example?
Then again, religion does tend to get in the way of reasonable thought. Since logical thought would cause christians to abandon their silly fairy tale belief structure anyway…
If Bush were trying to legislate Christianity, he’d be trying to ban homosexuality altogether, which ISN’T what he’s doing. Tell you what, Bladestar. You search the Bible. You find a condemnation of homosexual MARRIAGE, and I’ll cede the point.
The tradition of marriage being between a man and a woman is a fairly longstanding one, and it’s hardly restricted to the Christian faith (which you’re implying it is). Until fairly recently, marriage was almost entirely about the children that could be produced in a union, no matter how much the left would have us to believe otherwise. It’s only been in the last century or so (I think) that marriage had more to do with love than it did with children or political alliances.
I understand the desire to protect the current definition of marriage, but that’s not to say that the proposed amendment isn’t wrongheaded. Given that we have already redefined marriage as a structure centered purely around a fickle thing like love, it makes little sense to decide who is and is not allowed to love one another. It’s not as if two homosexuals are going to switch to being heterosexual purely because they can’t “marry.”
Besides, it’s an attempt at protecting a societal institution that is, in this modern time, utterly meaningless. (See: the marriages of Britney Spears and other celebrities)
It’s not religion that gets in the way of reasonable thought, it’s dogmatic thinking. “This is what we are taught and let no one say different.” Which is absolute balls, or we’d still be thinking the Earth was flat in the center of the universe.
Believe what you will, but do not claim it to be irrefutable fact, cause, y’know, we can pretty much refute anything if we put our minds to it.
Act upon your beliefs, but do not force them on others.
That said, the issue of Alpha Flight at hand sucked in the baddest of ways. Crappy art and crappy story-telling joining forces to squash any potential this story might have had. Even Rawhide Kid was better – and not just art-wise. Reading the column, I note that PAD puts forth some intriguing matters, issues and plot points, which kinda scream for a series to explore this.
Oh, and feel free to disagree with what I’ve just typed. It’s all true, of course, but don’t take my word for it. 😉
OK.. Enough about this gay marriage. It’s a non-issue at this point and all the other gay people whining about it and acting like it’s an important issue that we are going to win are just delusional. There are other more important issues that less people would contend with. For instance, let’s try passing laws that make it illegal to fire someone SOLELY because they are gay, lesbian, bi, trans, ect. At this point, unless you are in a particular state that doesn’t allow it (and there are few) or working for one of the companies that doesn’t allow it.
Besides, whining about how Bush is anti-gay because he doesn’t believe that a court has the right to decide with issues about gay marriage is just stupid. If you actually listened to a thing he said, which most of us gay people don’t because they’ve been brainwashed through years of propaghanda that Democrats are pro-gay, Bush has stated that he has NO problems with Civil Unions, which is all Kerry was going to try to offer anyhow. Besides thanks to Bill Clinton and the democrats in the House and Senate, the Defense of Marriage Act passed (very pro-gay) that allows states to defy the constitution and IGNORE gay marriages. The Constitution states that that wouldn’t be allowed under the birth/death/marriage certificate clause, but hey.. Democrats were never big on the constitution anyhow. Oh and on top of that, Bill Clinton gave the military a viable reason to kick gay people out of the military with his Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell policy. More people have been kicked out since that stupid policy came into effect than ever before! Don’t forget either that it’s recently been released that the “first black president” (That’s Bill) was actually telling Kerry to declare that he was against gay marriage! Then Kerry, to try to prove that Clinton wasn’t being manipulated and controlled by Clinton, despite having almost all of Clinton’s election team, said he refused to do it. So there is your pro-gay party that doesn’t give a rats butt about anybody, but themselves and getting re-elected.
Wow. That is truely a horrible story, even by Alpha Flight standards.
Okay, I never read AF that much. After Byrne left I stopped buying it and only picked up an issue when I heard that Bill Mantlo had totally and blatently ripped off the Demon Queen from Redfox to create the Dream Queen. Reading that issue I noticed that Puck had now been retconned to be normal size and the whole dwarf thing was an evil curse.
I never felt the need to read another issue, though I was almost tempted when I heard that they brought back Guardian in almost the same way that Byrne did, except it was done straight. How bad could it be?
So prompted by this discussion I read 106 and find that Puck is now a dwarf again and Northstar is barely recognisable in shape or characterisation. But then neither is anyone else. Most of the team barely get a line, and now they all dress the same it’s hard to tell which is which.
I’m amazed the series lasted as long as it did, and I have to assume that there was some decent writing and art inbetween the crap.
None of which is a comment on the gay issue, just an opinion of the comic. In comics, as with real life, I don’t honestly see that a person’s sexuality is anyone else’s business (unless it’s a story on the subject, obviously). People don’t go around asking others whether they like to be tied up or having their feet licked, so why should it matter whether they like to cuddle up with boys or girls?
Back when Northstar was supposedly from the realm of fairy, what was the explanation for his sister not being sick? Surely she should have been suffering as badly as he was. And was Major Mapleleaf a deliberate parody of Captain Canuck?
> Back when Northstar was supposedly from the realm of fairy, what was the explanation for his sister not being sick? Surely she should have been suffering as badly as he was.
What’s funny is that, when they retconned away the fairy thing, they never actually explained why he’d been sick in the first place…
> Back when Northstar was supposedly from the realm of fairy, what was the explanation for his sister not being sick? Surely she should have been suffering as badly as he was. And was Major Mapleleaf a deliberate parody of Captain Canuck?
It was said that living on Earth affected Jean-Paul physically and affected Jeanne-Marie mentally. That’s why she had a split personality. (Does this mean that Bruce Banner is also a half-fairy?)
I think Guardian/Vindicator are much more “Captain Canuck” like than Major Mapleleaf. The Major was dressed like a “Mountie” in the classic red serge dress uniform, wasn’t he? THere have certain been a few RCMP-type heroes in Canadian comics – like Kip Keene of the Men of the Mounted.
Allen
P.S.: I guess in Marvel continuity, the real world October crisis of 1970 now happened around 1990. Both Northstar and DC’s Plastique are tied to the FLQ.
Yes, I always felt that Marvel missed a big opportunity not promoting Guardian/Vindicator more as a”major” character, and the Canadian equal of Captain America.
As originally conceived, the character had a LOT of potential.
IIRC, there was indeed an allusion made to… well, let’s just say that there was a hint made about *why* Wonder Woman always goes around saying “Suffering Sappho!”
It was in an arc of Justice League Task Force featuring only superheroines and for the duration of the story, J’onn J’onzz took on female form. (Which could lead to a whole new interpretation of “Martian Manhunter”…)
Wonder Woman made some remark about how the women took care of each other’s “needs” and when she got shocked looks from the other heroes, she said, “Well, after all, it *is* called *Paradise* Island…”
I wish I could recall the writer of those stories but I think he was some obscure hack who never went on to do any work of *real* significance in comics. 🙂
One of the things I always liked about Northstar was that the guy was always kinda portrayed as an arrogant prìçk. I know John Byrne as a guy isn’t popular on these boards but as a creator, he was on top of his game back then. I thought it took real guts to take a character who was going to “represent” gays in comic books to many people and make him imperfect. It reminded me a little of how Frank Miller was complaining around the same time that he was getting letters from readers spoiled by Claremont’s patented uber-women about how the character of Elektra wasn’t fair to women. He responded by saying that A) Elektra wasn’t designed to be a hero, she was the hero’s adversary and B) real women, just like men, have flaws. Just because Elektra was a cold killer didn’t mean *all women* were heartless or that Miller couldn’t write strong, moral women, Elektra just wasn’t one of them.
But back to Northstar, I think that Byrne’s portrayal would have made PAD’s story suggestions even stronger because now you not only have a character that’s the face of the gay community, he would be someone who doesn’t want the job and doesn’t have the temprament for it. (Kind of the gay superhero equivalent of Charles Barkley…)
Alpha Flight was one of my favorite comics when I was a Teen and Northstar was always my favorite team member. This was before I came to terms with my homosexuality and I may have latently picked up on it. When the issues came out wher he was getting sick, I could see where it was going. Much to my disappointment, I hated to see how Marvel “copped out”. By the time 106 came out, I had come to terms with who I was and I was slightly disapoointed with the issue and the aftermath. I guess I thought it would have made a bigger impact, but it was a bit of a let down. Then NorthStar disapperaed from the scene. I was happy to see him back a couple of years ago with the X-Men, and I wished he would have stayed with the team. He’s still one of my favorite Marvel heroes (current arguement of the definition of hero notwithstanding) and I hope someone who writes him in the future remains true to the character.
For a better treatment of gay characters, check out THE AUTHORITY and DORK TOWER. In both of these comics, we get to know the characters for several issues before discovering that they’re gay. (So they become characters who happen to be gay, not GAY characters.) In both, the revelation comes at a more natural time than while fighting with a villain (I believe that Apollo and the Midnighter had a post-action evening together, while Walden’s wexuality comes out (so to speak) during a chat with his sister.) They’re both natural, realistic opportunities; and neither is the sole focus of the characters, or the book. (My problem with the show ELLEN is that after she came out, every episode revolved around her sexuality.)
Bah.
Let’s face it, no one would even care about Northstar if he wasn’t gay. Hmmm… yeah, he’s gay, so what? He’s not interesting and a bit of jerk most of the time. Boring.
“Homosexuals cannot be heroes”
TIM LYNCH: “Senator Santorum? Is that you? Welcome! And here I didn’t even know you were a comics fan…”
You know, as a resident of Pennsylvania, I have heard a LOT of chatter that if Senator Santorum retains his Pennsylvania seat convincingly over what is almost certainly going to be a tough candidate, he becomes one of the leading contenders for the Republican nomination in 2008. His conservative message will play well in the South and he will be able to carry Pennsylvania and turn it red. Honestly, there were “red” areas in the state where he actually helped because many here don’t feel Dubya is conservative ENOUGH.
You heard it here, first.
“Posted by: JamesLynch at November 25, 2004 10:34 AM
For a better treatment of gay characters, check out THE AUTHORITY and DORK TOWER. In both of these comics, we get to know the characters for several issues before discovering that they’re gay. (So they become characters who happen to be gay, not GAY characters.) In both, the revelation comes at a more natural time than while fighting with a villain (I believe that Apollo and the Midnighter had a post-action evening together, while Walden’s wexuality comes out (so to speak) during a chat with his sister.) They’re both natural, realistic opportunities; and neither is the sole focus of the characters, or the book. (My problem with the show ELLEN is that after she came out, every episode revolved around her sexuality.)”
________________________________________
Well, I won’t argue that those books show better treatment of gay characters (I don’t read “Dork Storm” but really, it’s just that to my mind it’s an interpretation thing.) but since this story took place in Alpha Flight # 106 you really can’t argue that you didn’t “get to know the character for several issues before discovering that he’s gay.”
As for “Ellen,” well, there’s just no pleasing every person. This whole column was about how they never really did anything with the revelation that Northstar was gay. Other people (and you’re not the only one I know who’s said this) think Ellen did *too much* with the revelation that she was gay.
I imagine part of it was that the show got all this attention (and a boost in ratings) from her “coming out” episode and the thought was probably that since all these people came around to see the “gay episode,” they had better provide more of the same to keep the crowd. It was probably also some growing pains. I’m sure if the show had gone on, they would have found a better balance.
But it’s an old argument. I remember criticism of “The Cosby Show” because it wasn’t “black” enough. I believe Bill Cosby wanted to do a show that portrayed a black family that was the same as any other sitcom family. But then are they portraying the reality of black America’s family life?
I think this headache of how to represent any minority character is why most TV shows are about straight white Christians. I doubt it’s racism so much as a lack of desire to deal with everybody’s sensitivities.
What I always thought was funny was that Northstar being gay was never that big a secret. I rememenber WAY back when (it was when John Byrne was writing Alpha Flight, so it was before #28), I bought a copy of some early 80’s comic fan magazine (I can’t for the life of remember was it was called, but it wasn’t a cheap little fanzine, I bought it at a “real” newstand and it had staples and a glossy cover and everything.) Anyway, the feature article that month was “Women Superheroes” (the cover montage featured Wonder Woman, Supergirl and She-Hulk (in her FF uniform if that helps anyone place the time period)) and inside there was a mini interveiw with JB discussing not only the women in comic books, but the women who read comic books. Mr. Byrne states something to the effect that female readers are much more perceptive then male readers and that while most of the male readers were still totally in the dark, most of the females who wrote in had long since figured out that yes, Northstar was gay.
This article must have been published at least 6 1/2 years before Alpha Flight #106 was published. So when that issue came out and I said smugly to friends “I knew he was gay”, I meant I KNEW he was gay.
I guess what I’m saying is I never saw what the big deal was. The creator and writer of the character had already told us that 6 1/2 years ago.
Russ,
The “big deal” is because, well,
1.) Not everryone read the story you mentioned in a cheap comics fanzine and
2.) There’s a big diference between a writer and creator acknowledging that a character is gay and havng the character acknowledge it on the printed page.
Stan Lee has said there were some characters he created that he considered to be gay, but when he created them he couldn’t actually state it.
There were rumors swirling about Ellen Degeneres the “person” for years, yet it was her “character’s” revelation ON THE SHOW that was groundbreaking.
That’s why.
I remember that. There was a character in SGT. FURY AND HIS HOWLING COMMANDOS who was supposed to be gay, I think.
I always sort of wondered about Clay Quartermain in NICK FURY, AGENT OF S.H.I.E.L.D. but that’s just me, obviously.
Hysan,
Yes! The character in “Sgt. Fury and His Howling Commandos” (the name escapes me) is one of the characters Lee has taled about.
***sted by Bladestar at November 23, 2004 04:00 PM
DIdn’t you know that George W., the President of the United States of Jesus, declared war on homosexuals because they’re sinners? (In his sad fûçkìņg pathetic eyes at least)***
I didn’t know that the POTUS’s eyes could F**** people. Isn’t that what a person’s d*** is for?
Yes, wonderful! Take an old BID article and use it as another opportunity to spew vile venom on the President.
How anonymous and deliberately inflammatory of you.
WHAT ÃSSHØLÊ WROTE A STORY SAYING ICEMAN IS GAY!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??????????
I HAVE AN AXE, AND I WANT NAMES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Matt
(I have an article from when northstar “came out”, they metiion that the Pied Piper had been gay for a while, and no one cared.)
Matt Dow,
“WHAT ÃSSHØLÊ WROTE A STORY SAYING ICEMAN IS GAY?!?!”
Actually,no one has. Northstar had a crush on Iceman that was not returned. But since you seem to be so irrationally angry about this – and lacking in reading comprehension skills – the next time you want to look at what you accused the writerof such a story of being,you should lookin the mirror.
Dear Jerome Maida,
If I came across in my previous comment as irrational, I apologize.
Reading through the gargantuan list of posts about this topic, I was given the impression by some of the posters that someone (presumably Chuck Austen,) had decided that Iceman was gay.
Iceman is one of the few X-men that doesn
Why has this column entry from November been reposted?
Deano: I recall vaguely in the Jim Wilson(think that was his name)AIDS story in the Hulk people assumed that meant Jim was Gay ,I dont think it was ever stated what the exact cause of his infection with the virus was.Please feel free to clarify.
Luigi Novi: I believe he told Rick that his girlfriend left him when his condition was revealed. I see no reason to assume he was gay.
now they kill the gay character in wolverine. see issue 20-26.