At the Marvel/Fan press conference the other day, Marvel execs slapped CBG around because a CBG columnist (no, not me) allegedly stated that “most retailers” dislike Marvel’s non-reorder, non-overprint policy. Marvel says t’ain’t so. They said they did a study of 300 retailers, and know that for a fact.
Okay. I’ve done no study. All I know is what I’ve seen and heard anecdotally. I’ve seen some retailers write in to CBG praising the new policies. But I’ve also seen retailers writing in and complaining, in CBG and in Comic Retailer magazine, and a number have griped to me in person. I’ve no clue, though, if “most” of the retailers are unhappy campers.
Any retailers reading this? Tell me what you think. Anyone reading this know any retailers? Ask them what they think. I admit to a certain degree of curiosity. I have an opinion based purely on perception, but perceptions can be deceiving. So you guys tell me: Marvels non-reorder, non-overprint policy. Good thing or bad thing? Helping or hurting?
PAD
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All I can tell you is what the owner of my local store tells me. He hates it, BIG TIME. Whenever a good DC book comes out, and I order it after it is sold-out, he always remarks “good thing it is from a company who actually wants to sell comics.”
My personal take? Stupid policy.
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Publisher, MyMac.com
email: publisher@mymac.com
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Unless my notes from the press conference are totally off (it was a bad phone connection), Jemas never said 300 retailers are happy with Marvel’s policy. He said Marvel had consulted with more than 300 retailers. That is a fine but crucial distinction.
One of my best friends is a comics retailer and he is VERY unhappy with Marvel’s no-reprint/no-reorder policy. Incidentally, this has translated into a rather visceral dislike of Bill Jemas.
I’m the Manager of an Anime store that carries a small selection of Marvel, DC and Image titles to go with our Manga comics and we are very unhappy with the no-overprint policy. Our Marvel comics selection will likely never grow because we can not re-order the titles that become in demand if our customers don’t let us know in advance that they want a copy. We can not afford to gamble money on comics that may or may not sell when we could spend that on other merchandise for our store that we can guarantee will sell. Sure, some comics sell very well, but most do not including most Marvel titles so if we order heavily on all Marvel titles since we can’t re-order them, we will end up losing money in the long run. We would like to expand our selection and allow our customer base to grow in that area, but with this policy it is currently not feasible.
Why doesn’t Jemas do a poll of all stores rather than just the top 300? Most retailers may very well disagree with his policy, but the big retailers are the ones that matter the most to him. Maybe that is smart business policy on his part to listen to Mile High Comics rather than us, but it certainly doesn’t mean that most retailers are necessarily in agreement with him, just the largest ones.
Also, I think it is highly amusing that in Jemas’ claims of slander by CBG, he slanders DC by saying they are behind it all.
I used to think it was a dumb business move, but after reading retailer Chuck Rozanski’s take on it ( http://www.milehighcomics.com/tales/cbg03.html ), I’m on the fence. And honestly, most popular books are reprinted in trade paperback a few months later.
And here’s Part II of Chuck’s argument. http://www.milehighcomics.com/tales/cbg04.html
As the Owner of Atomic Comics in OKC, I see some positives and negatives. As collectors, this policy is good, as it obviously helps books grow in value in the long run. Most collectors and regular buyers in my store like this policy.
However, as a retailer, this policy hurts me, as if forces me to take much larger risks, and buy more copies of books which may or may not sell (or could be utter crap – see Marville). However, I can handle this, even if it does hurt me somewhat.
What I can’t handle, is the long term hurt this will do to the industry. Marvel books are some of the most recognized characters by young and new readers (X-men, spider-man, hulk, captain america, etc). Whenever a new reader attempts to go into a comic shop, and find the newest issue of a book, to find it is sold out, there is a good chance this reader is lost to the industry. Now, I give retailers some responsibility for this, but there is only so much overordering I can do and still stay in business. When I can’t get more copies of books like Ultimate Spider-man, which regularly sells out, I end up disapointing a potential life long comic reader.
I think in the long run, the future of the industry will be greater hurt by this policy.
Jerry Wall
Atomic Comics
>>Unless my notes from the press conference are totally off (it was a bad phone connection), Jemas never said 300 retailers are happy with Marvel’s policy. He said Marvel had consulted with more than 300 retailers. That is a fine but crucial distinction.<<
I know what Jemas said. He said the “vast majority” of the 300 retailers polled were happy. I agree it’s a fine but crucial distinction; I just hadn’t thought what I said implied all 300 retailers were of a like mind. But if you feel the statement required clarification, by all means.
PAD
The store that I go to is unhappy with the policy for a different reason. That reason is Diamond. He is constantly getting Marvel titles short-shipped and/or missed. The problem he runs into is that if Diamond is then out of that particular book, he can not reorder it for the Customers that did not receive the book, due to the policy.
This has been happening since Diamond closed the Atlanta, GA warehouse and moved the operations to Memphis, TN.
It is also aggravating for Customers that pre-ordered the Marvel books, but now have to hunt for them because Diamond neglected to ship them to the store.
Although he does have quite a few copies of Marville in the store, but no Captain Marvel issues. I wonder why?
Also, I’m pretty sure I read on Kevin Smith’s website that he, as a retailer, disliked the no-overprint policy. Seems like his voice should carry some weight.
My local retailer, and all independent shop owners I’ve spoken to, absolutely loath it. No-reprint makes their already difficult job, a total crapshoot. Especially when it comes to miniseries. And the non-existent solicitation info that Marvel puts in Previews these days is even worse.
My best friend is a retailer, and he gets so mad about it, he continually swears he’s going to stop ordering their stuff altogether. The reason why:
Damages.
Diamond (and I’ve unpacked his stuff, so this is first hand) has the most incompetent people packing their boxes that you could possibly imagine. So, if all of his copies of “The Hood” come with a nasty corner crunch that renders them unsellable, he has to cross his fingers that he actually gets replacements. He’s actually had Amazing Spider-Mans come that way and been unable to get replacement copies. It is horrible how that stuff gets sent.
My friend is a mail order store, and in three plus years, he has *never* had a damaged book arrive on someone’s doorstep, thanks to his packing diligence. It makes him apoplectic that Diamond doesn’t do the same.
Marc
PAD,
I wasn’t implying a lack of clarity on your part, rather pointing out a certain abount of finessing on Jemas’ part. As he puts it, what he says can be true (most retailers Marvel consulted are happy) while it is also true that most retailers are unhappy.
I can also attest to Diamond’s awful packing problems. Before the recent relocation of their warehouses, we used to get large quantities of our merchadise damaged from them, especially toys and models. Most items can be replaced however, but not Marvel’s stuff. All of our copies of some of their titles have come in damaged from time to time and we have at times been unable to get replacements due to their policy. “Origin” for example, one of Marvel’s most popular titles, all came in damaged. Guess what, no replacements available. I heard that this was a problem at many retail establishments last year. Made some speculators happy I’m sure, we weren’t happy though and neither were our customers.
Now that Diamond has relocated their warehouse to Memphis, we are getting far less damages so far, but shortages and misships(Like sending us copies of 10Th Muse instead of Blue Monday this week) are way up. Diamond will most likely be able to fix this problem by next week but, once again if this happens to a Marvel title, most likely both the retailer and customer are screwed.
>>As the Owner of Atomic Comics in OKC, I see some positives and negatives. As collectors, this policy is good, as it obviously helps books grow in value in the long run.<<
True. On the other hand, if the industry chooses to focus on collectors rather than fans, it’s doomed. it’s a policy that hurts everybody.
For example, a movie studio would never force a theater to commit to a certain number of showings of a film months before its release and refuse to allow them to change it regardless of how many people actually want to pay to see it. “Sorry, I know people are lined up around the block for the new Bond film, but you’ve shown it as many times as you’re allowed to, so get lost.” That would be crazy. It hurts the studio that could get more money from increased admissions, the theater that would do the same from admissions and concessions, and the fans who actually want to see the movie but aren’t being allowed to. The only people it really helps are those who would actually get inm and see the movie and get bragging rights. (Nothing collectable that will appreciate in value, though; I haven’t given this much thought, and my analogy is breaking down.) never heard of a company refusing to sell consumers exactly the product they want, but hey, I’m not an executive.
On an unrelated note, I’m grateful for the notice that user comments are the copyright of the users. Too many places online, notably about.com though there are many others, take the stand that “We own your words,” and it’s nice to see someone go explicitly in the opposite direction. Thanks for that consideration.
I think the policy’s a good idea; makes the comics more profitable and gives a boost to Marvel’s fledging TPB system.
By the way PAD, could you put proper spoiler warnings in your Buffy posts? Us poor brits don’t get to see the new series for a year or so; other countries could have it worse so let’s not have it wrecked eh? 🙂
PS Loved CM 4.2!
Hello, I’m a retailer in Western PA. I do not like or agree with Marvel’s terms of no-reprint. I also do not agree that this fueling the “collectible” side of comics is good. I consider my store to be one that is “reader” friendly rather than “collector” friendly. I feel it’s only by getting more books into the hands of readers that will help our industry. Here are some good examples of what I mean: Green Arrow #1 from DC went on to a fourth printing. I was able to continually reorder this comic (as well as the other issues) and get it into the hands of readers. Whenever the book would sell down, I’d reorder. Until recently (a couple weeks ago) I had every Green Arrow comic still available on the rack here in my shop. (Meaning, these issues are still racked, I’m just sold out of a couple). I currently sell nearly double Green Arrow as opposed to Ultimate Spider-man. Another example is Green Lantern. Within the last 6 months (from issue 148) I’ve doubled my sales on this title. Why? Because it’s been available for reorder (and people want to read it). Same as with Green Arrow, I would reorder as the book sold down and kept it readily available for readers. I can say with confidence, had Marvel instituted a reprint policy (not to mention having confidence in their own product by overprinting) I would be selling more copies of Ultimate Spider-man (or DD or Hulk or Amazing) to more readers. Which, as I’m sure you can guess, means extra Green (not Arrows or Lanterns) for Marvel as well.
So, to answer: Is it a bad thing? Yes. Is it hurting? Can’t say. It certainly isn’t helping.
Roy Thompson
Phantom of the Attic – Monroeville, PA
My local retailer hates it passionately, for many of the reasons cited above. She thinks that if they are going to do this, they should at the very least have a policy of replacing damaged books. Diamond seems to damage at least a few books every shipment to her shop. That would at least prevent her from losing more money on it.
She’s also peeved that they aren’t giving any story info in Previews at all. It makes it very difficult to order. She’s getting close to not having extra copies of most Marvel books for the shelves because she a) doesn’t know what the book is about and b) can’t reorder it if it’s a hit.
The store I shop at received a box that was deliverd in such a state that all the comics in it were completely destroyed.
This included all 30 copies of Ultimate Spider-Man that came in that week.
The No Reorder, No Overprint meant that all his customers that bought the title didn’t get that issue.
I don’t like the policy, the comics should be available for reprint and reorder.
Peter,
As we discussed briefly at Dragon Con in Atlanta, I am not happy about this no over print policy.
Diamond Comics Distributors, in their infinite wisdom, has shorted my business (Legends in Rome, Ga.) Marvel titles in the past. When I call to report the shortage, most times I get “you may not get the replacements on this hot title.” Who to blame? Diamond for the shortage? Yes. Marvel for the no over print policy. Yes, of course. Where does that leave me and customers? Shorted.
I really like using this as an example (no slight towards you is meant), but I got NO copies of the Greg Horn cover of Marville #1. I actually have a few regular customers who only wanted it for the Greg Horn cover (because they met him in Atlanta).
I informed Diamond of the shortage and was told I * might * get replacement copies.
So far, issue #2 has arrived and I’ve still not gotten the #1. My regular customers have purchased it elsewhere, therefore IF issue #1 (Greg Horn cover) does show up, I will be stuck with them. Ain’t life great?
The paper will need more salt (when I sit down to eat them).
Personally, it was the nail in my coffin. I closed my store a couple of months after this policy was established. I didn’t want to deal with a supplier that didn’t want to help me out.
My store wasn’t in a large enough area to just increase orders to prevent a sellout. I went the opposite direction, and didn’t order any for stock OR the rack.
And, now, if I miss an issue of one of the few Marvel titles I still follow, guess what; I drop it. Forever.
As a retailer for over 8 years I dislike the policy. Hate is too strong an emotion for this.
It hurts us with initial orders, re-orders, and damage replacement. It means when I have a book that jumps up for no particular reason (we are a college town, kinda hard to estimate what will be hot semester to semester) or Diamond thought that it would be a good idea to leave our shipping boxes sitting in the rain.
It is a good policy for secondary market values, but Marvel doesn’t see any of this money, so why would that matter to them?
Overall my biggest complaint is that the books are not available to us (the retailer) to sell to the end customer. DC has them available, Image – available, Dark Horse – Available, CrossGen – available, heck even Chaos had the books available. But not Marvel.
It just doesn’t make sense in the long run. Yes, they might get sales from TPBs in the future, but they lose a customer in the present. Is the possibility of a sale in the future better than a sale now? No. Runs are forgotter, collections stopped, comics cancled all due to non-availability.
jeff brown
Lone Star Collectables
well, since i
The policy is not the worst thing in the world. It’s quite responsible and smart…why should marvel print excess in the HOPES that there would be re-orders?
If you are cycling sales…then you should know what to order. And this is great when you are ordering something like thunderbolts #60 or whatnot…you know what you can sell and you order appropriatly. But in the case of a hot new series (origin, Truth, New capt. marvel) or a HOT new writer or artist taking over a book…then marvel should overprint because there is no data telling you how many copies to order, and why should the retailer bear all the risk? How many of the last few “hot” comics from marvel did bill and joe express dissapointment because they were underordered? If they want us to have faith in the new product, they should have faith in the new product. (although no one should have any faith in marville…god is that the worst book ever?)
So in essence the policy makes sense for long running series, but new series or potentially hot issues should be looked at case by case and overprints should be common sense in those cases.
>>By the way PAD, could you put proper spoiler warnings in your Buffy posts? Us poor brits don’t get to see the new series for a year or so; other countries could have it worse so let’s not have it wrecked eh? :)<<
I’d second that suggestion. I was entirely pleased last Spring when I saw Newsarama’s link to this site, and dutifully followed it. To my horror, the first post I saw was the one griping about a certain character getting killed off (I’m not mentioning who, in deference to the poor Brit) … which *really* sucked, seeing as how it was only a day or two after the ep had aired, and I was still a couple of eps behind.
It was still an emotionally moving scene, but the shock and surprise weren’t there.
OT: We also dislike the no-overprint policy – not so much due to reorders (I too run a mail-order subscription service), but due to the aforementioned problem re: damages. One of the differences, however, is that we actually guarantee our orders – so if Diamond shorts us or sends us damaged books, we have our guy go and buy copies wherever he can (often at since-inflated prices) to sell at the promised discount.
To this day, our buyer still talks with great irritation about the many MANY copies of ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN #5 he had to shell out big bucks for. (This was right after they implemented the policy – and stupidly forgot to allocate ANY amount for damaged books.)
I know my local retailer hated it. In fact it was one of the final nails in the coffin for his business.
Comic shops are dropping like flies (there used to be about a dozen shops within a 40 mile radius of where I live… within the last 5 years all but 2 of them has closed) and Marvel is doing NOTHING but hurting the already dying comics industry.
The fact that it is incredilby hard to find Marvel titles in shops anymore because of the no reorder policy, and the fact the Marvel no longer puts any info in Previews about their titles (not to mention the fact that I think Jemas and Quesada are áššëš and I hate many of the the things they have done) has caused me to drop all Marvel books… And this is from a 15 year comics fan who bought an equal ratio of DC to Marvel (about 25 titles from each company) monthly.
I’m still sticking with Amazing Spider-Man through #50, then I’ll be buying my last Marvel book (and no offense to Peter, I love your work and follow all your other titles, but I could never get into Captain Marvel because I didn’t care about the character.)
As a retail comics store owner for about 20 years, all I can add is that the policy is noisome and serves no evident purpose, save allowing Marvel to report higher sell-through figures in their quarterly reports.
Any company that does not have the simple faith to stand behind their products, most especially the ones they are touting as more worthwhile than the norm, does not deserve nor obtain my respect.
Now, with the useless listings in Previews, all retailers must order every Marvel title ‘blind’ as well.
Could expound at length, but don’t want to use your venue for as my soapbox. Suffice it to say that no retailer with whom I have been in contact (and I mean literally zero) has voiced support for these perversions of the direct sales pipeline.
And now Marvel’s new agreement with Wal-Mart is another stake in our hearts – does anyone really not think that Wal-Mart is getting a much better discount (if, indeed, there is not actually some type of profit-sharing agreement), plus returnability on these books, or that, realistically, the entire program is able to be subsidized by the retailers, who in toto make up the lion’s share of Marvel’s comics sales?
Well, we can wait this fiasco out, too. Wal-Mart will turn out to be a fair weather friend once sales dip – it is just the nature of that particular juggernaut. But retailers can and will only stand being treated as the gutter filth on Marvel’s shoe soles for only so long.
As a side note, Marvel certainly has not contacted me in any way about this (or any other) matter in any of the past 20 years – nor deigned to return even a cursory response when contacted. And this is not to slam Marvel – the same holds true for virtually every publisher. As for Diamond – well, let’s just say the each year on their ‘satisfaction survey’ I write in exactly the same comments, which echo statements that have been given verbally, and not a one has ever been addressed, remedied nor followed up by so much as a phone call.
Mr. Jemas may (or may not) be a brilliant corporate tactician, but his public relations and customer service skills, especially when dealing with non-major metropolitan stores, are abysmal. The unfortunate corollary of continually making it evident that you don’t need us (or have any interest in exploring the feasibility of, much less implementing, any input) is that, when the time comes, we can respond without remorse that we don’t need you. And that will not be a happy day for any of the parties concerned.
I absolutely hate the policy – as does everybody I’ve spoken to in the city.
Besides the fact that damages and missing issues are difficult if not impossible to replace, it makes ordering difficult at times.
Ordering 3 months in advance is difficult when it comes to new series. To mini-series. To new writers/artists. To crossovers. Good Lord the crossovers.
You base a mini-series on another series – presumedly the one it is spun out of – but it’s a win or lose, that one. Sometimes people don’t want it – it’s not the current writer/artist team – and other times people want it – can anybody say, ‘Origin’?
I likely could have sold 10x the amount of Origin that I did through re-orders. I admit, I underestimated the popularity of the series, but that’s what it boils down to: retailer risk. For better or worse, I’m happy I sold-out, rather then have a million copies I don’t need.
But it does happen quite often. Marvel’s no-overprint policy forces retailers to order above and beyond what they think might sell, just in case it becomes the ‘next hot item.’
For comparison’s sake.. compare Ultimate Adventures to, oh, Ultimates.
With Ultimate Adventures we orders something close to Ultimate Spider-Man, based on the fact that all Ultimate Titles do fairly well. Woof. It bombed. Something hard, did it bomb. And of course, we’ve already ordered issues 2 & 3, so we KNOW those won’t sell.
With Ultimates however, again, we ordered near (I think above) Ultimate Spider-Man #s, and we sold out. Blink of an eye we sold out, and we still have people asking for early issues.
Have I made my point? Heh. I always do that dammit. I ramble and forget where I was going.
The point is, I hate their no-overprint policy. There -has- to be something of a middle-ground to be found – their “Might Marvel” craptacular collections are just that: craptacular. And people don’t want to buy Trade Paperbacks if they’re only missing one or two issues.
It sucks.
I’ve asked my local shops the same question, and they’ve mentioned they’re ordering less Marvel Product as a result, not more. Instead, they’re getting more DC stuff, LOTS more CrossGen, and bulked up their Indie/import sections. And even then their Marvel stuff sits on the shelf, Anything CrossGen sells out consistently, And most of their DC stuff sells out-and they can still re-order it.
And their Marvel numbers are still dropping (something I think PAD knows all to well). Nobody wants to order Marvel product they know won’t sell. So they don’t go nuts over any Marvel title, since either the book will ship late, or wait and order the trade (which can be re-ordered, funny that).
I brought this nugget to Q’s attention, and he gave it a non-response. I mean what could he say, really?
This not just a case “stupid retailers” as Jemas wants to put it-they’re just getting smarter and not plunking dimes on stuff that they cannot sell.
all I can add is that the policy is noisome and serves no evident purpose, save allowing Marvel to report higher sell-through figures in their quarterly reports
And that’s pretty much hitting the nail on the head (perhaps even the same nail used in the coffins of closed-up comic shops). I don’t think Bill Jemas holds these press conferences for the benefit of the fans or even the retailers. His concern is, and will always be, the shareholders and the quarterly reports. I think that’s his primary audience.
Re: the comment above about it never happening that a movie studio would order a theater to show a picture for N weeks, no matter how well it’s doing. Um, Star Wars Eps 1 and 2 were under just that policy. And, as I recall, it was further specified that they had to be shown in the largest theater in a multiplex for the first M weeks, where I believe the total for N was around 12, and M at least 6.
And, in general, there’s certainly an incentive for a theater to show a movie for a long period of time, as the percentage of the gross that the theater gets goes up with time. The first week or two, the studio’s getting, if I’m recalling correctly, 80-90% of the ticket sales. What with the new movie trend of doing massive business the first week followed by dropping off a cliff for most movies, there’s a reason the concession stand prices (which all goes to the theater) have gotten so high.
His concern is, and will always be, the shareholders and the quarterly reports. I think that’s his primary audience.
Which isn’t unreasonable for a company that recently emerged from bankruptcy protection. But it is, nevertheless, short-term thinking. Via the no-overprint policy Jemas and Marvel have shifted the risk from themselves to retailers. Marvel doesn’t risk getting stuck with books, but retailers who “overorder” to make sure they have enough supply do. Or, otherwise, they risk losing sales because of a lack of supply. There may be, as some have said here, cases where the policy has backfired on Marvel. But I’ve asked around at shops in my area, and it seems here that Marvel’s plan is working. Shops overorder Marvel to make sure they have enough copies, and they cut back on DC, etc., because they know they can place a reorder later if necessary. One shop doesn’t order CrossGen at all.
I am a comics retailer of more than 10 years. Skring pretty eloquently summed up my own feeling about a number of Marvel’s recent actions, so I will try not to repeat too many of them here.
I will say that I am SHOCKED to discover that I am aparently NOT amoung the “Top 300” stores, as Marvel has not contacted me in any manner since they fired my customer service rep several years ago. I do not run one of those “dirty, smelly, poorly run shops” that are apparently the only ones complaining about Marvel’s policies. My shop is clean, well run and pretty darn profitable. DC is certainly not without its’ flaws as an organization. However, DC at the very least manages to put a spin on its’ actions that make the retailer (that would be me) feel that DC is not only not the enemy, but actually a benevolant ally when it comes to retailing comics. On the other hand, Marvel has consistantly answered querries or complaints with responses that basically ammount to “What are you, Stupid?”
Their disdain for comic shop owners seems pretty deeply rooted, and none seem to represent this more than Jemas.
So when it came time to order Captain Marvel and Marville, what did I do? I ordered 50 copies of Captain Marvel #1 and 2 copies of Marville. I intend to do no disservice to any of my customers who might want the book. All they have to do is ask and I will be glad to re-order the book for them.
In this day and age comic shop owners have to be prety carefull where they put their money. I choose to put mine behind a creator that has a proven track record and has consistantly stayed on books.
I’m not sure where Bill Jemas gets his information, but I can vouch for myself as one retailer who finds Marvels No Reprint policy to be short sighted. I do, however, understand the business motivation behind it. When every other new book from Marvel comes out with a sales pitch of “Remember Ultimate Spider-Man and Origin! Don’t be caught short! Order LOTS!” there is the temptation to over order Marvel books in hopes of having a supply of whatever book turns out to the be the next hit. I’d like to think I had learned better than that in my years of retailing, but as skring mentioned, we order Marvel’s books pretty much blind.
ZeroMan,
Given the way Marvel has cut back on the information it provides in Previews, I’d say having retailers “order blind” is Marvel’s company policy.
ok, I know PAD asked for retailers or for people with retail experience.
However, what about comments from a fan’s point of view?
The obvious ones from above being that if comics come in damaged or short we get shafted, the offshoot of that is going somewhere else or ordering online or mail order, and the local business possibly going under due to lack of support.
My thoughts on this, being a comics fan since the late 70’s.
I used to be a big fan of marvel bought x-men spiderman and a slew of other titles.
I don’t anymore.
it occured to me as I was reading the threads that I haven’t bought a marvel comic in almost 8 months at least until the other day when I saw mark waid’s name on the fantastic four.
One of the main reasons is I don’t care anymore what happens to my once favorite characters, some of the stories these days just don’t give me a reason to.
my advice would be to work more on the story and flow of the characters and books.
I can understand WHY marvel marvel has it’s policy but in my opinion, cut back on some of the bells and whistles and go back to being the hosue of ideas..the creativity.
Might do a lot more towards getting and keeping readers than what they are doing.
I may be making this all overly simplistic and people can look at my comments and say that I have no idea about how big business works and they are probably right, however I’ve been reading comics for almost 30 years and I know what I like and I’ve given up buying pale imitations of books I used to love.
Heads of Marvel, Diamond and other companies may and can dismiss my comments and others like mine and I may be just a grain of sand in the comic mass market but enough grains of sand leave the beach leads to erosion and no more beach…….
No overprint is Marvel inflating their own sales numbers in order to make the company look more attractive for a buyout. Marvel’s been structuring for a buyout since they came out of bankrupcy, and interestingly has been postioning itself to be what AOL lists DC as- an R&D write off for a buyer- which is essentially what Jemas and Quesada both flogged about what’s wrong with DC in their “interviews” with Mark Millar.
Commenting as a former comic/gaming store owner and former bookstore manager I see two problems, loosely related: (1) the no overprinting and (2) damages.
The damages problem is a far greater issue as it involves a third party, although a powerful party: Diamond Distribution. Diamond has little liability whatsoever with the situation, and their position is such that it undermines the goal for both the publisher and the retailer. I would think any damages Diamond would be unable to replace becomes Diamond’s purchase at full retail price (“ya break it, ya bought it”). Of course, the retailer would be responsible for the wholesale purchase. Although the store customers would be out of luck, at least the store would not lose the sale (as aside, I realize the retailer is credited for the damaged goods, but that is a wholesale credit often less than the profit with the sale presuming no discounts – have to presume no discounts to keep it fair). That Diamond gets away with a near-monopoly is bad enough – that they do not have liability with the product they distribute seems inappropriate.
The overprinting issue: I don’t know when store owners decided it was the responsibility of the publishers to hold their hands post-publication. That the retailer failed to understand their market, their clientelle, their ability to sell – sorry, shame on the retailer for not running their business. In the book trade, magazines routinely are print to order – once Glamour, Business Week, Print or Comics Buyers Guide, etc. is sold out off the stand – constant reader was out of luck (or at least forced to visit another store or search the web). Same rules apply for comics in my mind – once store runs out of Avengers, sorry, out of luck. If the store under ordered, well, yell at the store owner for not running the business well enough (or yourself for not securing your purchase with some kind of pull request).
If the store owner ordered, and Diamond screwed it up – well, call Diamond as a fan and thank them for the extra work their screw up caused you. Ask them where you should go since your regular source has been shafted by Diamond.
If Marvel ships it four months late, well, Marvel needs to eat some cost.
Only real issue is with the solicitations policy Marvel has now. I’ve read Previews for over a decade, and the current Marvel format simply is not enough information for a retailer to take a risk. Every other publication that is print to order provides enough details for stores to decide order quantity. Right now, Marvel’s inability to balance marketing with communication should be the issue, since the present method is pretty bad and irresponsible on Marvel’s part.
I disagree with the policy. I think that it a) just contributes to a new speculator market with less copies floating around and b) in the long run will hurt sales of certain titles, and I think just provides a frenzy of trying to buy the titles that Wednesday (or Thursday if there is a federal holiday the Monday or Tuesday that Precedes the Wednesday) because by the Weekend, “BIG MARVEL MAINSTAY DOE #3,000,000” is already gone, unless you have a pull slot. I think that if Bill Jemas REALLY WANTS MARVEL TO BE READER FRIENDLY, HE’LL DROP THE POLICY.
By the way, when I mention “in the long run.”, I’m talking about overall. As in Annual Sales. The problem with the final earnings are always monthly or quarterly, and probably would reflect a Sales spike, but if it were year end, maybe you find that the spike wasn’t as permanent as you may have thought. (OK, so Business and Marketing are not my strong suits, but Common sense is, and my common sense tells me Jemas would have more READERS if he DROPPED THE POLICY.)
Charles F. Waldo
P.S. Did I mention that Jemas should DROP THE POLICY?
Hello, PAD! Anyone who knows me already knows my opinion: I hate the “no-overprint” policy. It is a shortsighted policy created to maximize profits for MARVEL COMICS in the short term with no consideration towards the future health of the comics market.
Unfortunately, as long as the current regime reigns at MARVEL, I see no changes in store anytime soon.
Just in case it is of interest, Here are a few excerpts from Joe Quesada’s reply to my open letter:
Matthew Hawes: “I wish Marvel would listen and consider the opinions of all retailers.”
Joe Quesada: “We do, we have retailer conference calls at least once a month. We have Diamond select 25 retailers at random and we do one on ones with Bill J and me. When’s the last time you had a 2 hour call with Paul Levitz?”
Matthew Hawes: “At WIZARDWORLD in Chicago of this past year I was witness to the Q&A panel where you were a guest. I listened as you talked about Brian Hibb’s lawsuit and made comments to the effect that this is not one of your top retailers. You made special note that he did not even place in the Top 1000. This point seemed to be raised in an effort to present Mr. Hibbs as a “nobody” to the audience in attendance. Mr. Jemas made a similar remark about a retailer that he was in debate with on Comicon’s message boards, insinuating that the retailer was not important enough to consider his opinions because Mr. Jemas had checked and saw that the retailer did not place high enough on Marvel’s retailer’s list.”
Joe Quesada: “No, the point was that Hibb’s didn’t even place in the top 400 and yet he wants to tell people how to run their business. As a business man and an artist it’s very simple to me. When I looked at my future pending career 10 years ago, I asked myself who did I want to role model. I went on a quest to get business and art advise from all of the top guys in the field. I did not go to the least successful of the art community to ask them how I should do my business or how I should draw. If I wanted to be mediocre, perhaps I would want to hear what they had to say but I wanted to be successful so I listened to successful people and allowed that advice to affect my business. I’m sure as a store owner it’s the same for you. I’m sure there is someone in your state who you think does a poor job with their store and you probably kick their ášš. I sincerely doubt that you would allow that businessman to affect your stores business policy. Hibbs is very loud and very pushy and if you ever get into a debate with him you will quickly realize it isn’t a debate because if your opinion differs he isn’t listening to you. He’s just waiting for you to be done so he can talk over you and run you over. Sometimes people mistake this for someone being right. Brian Hibbs doesn’t know how to be a successful businessman in comics in my opinion. He is in the SF Bay area which is a boomtown for comics yet his nearest competitor does twice the business he does. I know, I looked it up. So if Hibbs can’t even be the best store in his own neighborhood, why should people give his opinion on business as much credence as they do? Because he’s a squeaky wheel. I even received a letter from the folks at CBG that they understood what I was complaining about. You see even though they get more mail complaining about things, whether it’s overprint or anything in comics, they understand that people who are happy don’t write letters. People who are angry write letters and sometimes we believe that they make up a majority. Here’s a very telling sign. Usually when we protest something like Heidi’s letter I get tons of e-mail from people wanting to correct me. Do you know how many e-mail’s I’ve received about this particular issue, Matthew? No joke, two. That is an all time low and tells me a lot.”
Joe Quesada: “Matthew, we consider all of our accounts but no two accounts agree on any one single thing. We also can’t allow our accounts to dictate business practices because we would go out of business trying to please everyone. Look, let’s be honest, this is business, it’s not a democracy, not everyone is created equal on this playing field. Heck, I go to baseball games and I wish the Mets would take my advice on how to put a team together but it just aint gonna happen. We listen to every opinion, and you can take this incredibly long e-mail as proof of that, we just have to assimilate all of that stuff and then do what we feel is best for MOST of the accounts and for MOST of the business. I’m not taking into consideration how much Marvel stuff you order yet I’m sitting here typing this stuff out. Once again, when’s the last time you had this conversation with the head of a major publisher?”
Matthew Hawes: “What Heidi MacDonald says, it is what many of us feel.”
Joe Quesada: “But not all.”
Matthew Hawes: “Please don’t dismiss this. And don’t believe doing so will make the issue go away. Marvel has pretended that the issue was closed for two years, yet it remains an important issue to this day to retailers. So important that Ms. MacDonald’s column got the attention of the heads of Marvel Comics. I’d say that that’s a live issue. I’d suggest that that sends a message that this issue is important and that even though the Emperor won’t acknowledge it, he has no clothes.”
Joe Quesada: “No, the issue is that after talking to so many retailers that are converts to the new system, we have just grown tired of people kicking Marvel when we’ve been improving people’s businesses. Enough is enough, Heidi just got in the cross hairs.”
–quote–
Joe Quesada: “No, the issue is that after talking to so many retailers that are converts to the new system, we have just grown tired of people kicking Marvel when we’ve been improving people’s businesses. Enough is enough, Heidi just got in the cross hairs.”
— end quote —
That is the single funniest paragraph I’ve read in months.
Thanks for posting it.
Nice to know that, if it comes to it, Mr. Quesada has a future doing stand-up.
Reading the rest just makes me sadly shake my head in disbelief at how much self-serving tripe is dished out instead of actually answering a question.
“We can’t allow our accounts to dictate business practices…” – unless it is decided to do such for major chain stores who shall remain unnamed. *sigh* is it really necessary to reiterate stuff from Business 101 and bring up ‘New Coke'(or, to be more germane, the Spider-clone) as to why such an attitude is boneheaded?
It sounds as if the comment should read “when was the last time you were lectured to and berated by the head of a major publisher.”
Parse the entire post into this:
“We’ll listen to anyone who agrees totally with what we say and do, and to hëll with anyone else on the subject. If our policies haven’t skyrocketed sales for some, then they must be at fault; ipso facto their comments regarding anything that might be advantageous in their cases (since, as mentioned in the original comment, one size does not fit all) must be worthless, uninformed, contrary and beneath notice.”
I also take umbrage at the language that refers to retailers as objects, rather then people (‘that’ rather than ‘who’ – mayhaps a (Freudian) slip that reveals more of the mindset than intended).
Enough. As would any rational being, I much prefer being ignored to being pìššëd on. Maybe after the posturing is over and the dust has settled, retailers will be able to participate in an actual two-way conversation. Until such time, I suppose I shall smile indulgently at the petulant, bratty behavior being exhibited and chalk it up to hubris, ignorance, or a combination thereof.
My local retailer (whom I work for) hates the policy. Between the current ads in Previews that tell us nothing and not over printing there isn’t much point in ordering Marvel titles for people who aren’t already subscribed to them. We can’t guage a title’s potential success based on the Previews information, so unless someone specifically asks for a new title we aren’t likely to order it. It’s like playing Pin the Tail on the Donkey without benefit of having the Donkey present. Or a tail to pin on him.
Add my name to the chorus asking for Marvel to try overprinting. I’m already on record elsewhere, speculating about how the no overprint policy at Marvel has probably contributed to the surprise success of the Transformers. After all, with Spider-Man breaking box office records: shouldn’t Spider-Man comics also be setting comic sales records, the way the Batman movie did back in 1989? But then, DC made sure to print to meet demand – NOT manipulate demand. The last time Marvel Execs missed an opportunity with a hit move, it cost them their jobs. While I doubt that Bill is worried about what retailers really think, he might be worried that someone in a position of power over him hears what we’re saying – and finds some credance in it. Otherwise, why not just try a pilot test program to satisfy us and quiet all our barking? Instead he just yelled out the ivory tower window: “shut up – before the boss upstairs hears it.” Nothing personal against Bill, and certainly nothing against Joe, but their stubborness and refusal to satisfy the customers baffles me.