Folks are dropping me congratulating e-mails about the fact that CAPTAIN MARVEL continues to lead the other two titles in the “U-Decide” contest. I appreciate the thoughts…but I think the forest is not being seen for the trees that died to print the books.
CM #1 was the best reviewed, best received title of the three in September. Fan response was, “Well, of course, what did you expect, Peter David is the best writer, yadda yadda.” But that issue (granted three covers, but still) sold around 54,000. Issue #2? Around 33,000. Twenty thousand copy drop off right there. As opposed to “Ultimate Adventures” which sold a “paltry” 35,000 in September but around 29,000 in October. Not remotely as drastic a drop.
And just for fun, let’s compare CM #2 to books outside of “U-Decide.” Remember “The Hulk,” the series fans shouted they would never read again because I’d been shoved out the door? Mid 50’s. Issue #2 of CM guest stars the Punisher, and that month’s issue of “The Punisher” is in the mid 40’s. So in relation to the Hulk it’s not selling, and in relation to the Punisher it’s not selling.
Gotta say, folks…not liking this trend. Because I want to introduce a notion here: Bill Jemas said that whichever book sells the most of the three will continue beyond issue #6. He didn’t say how long, though, did he.
I inadvertently set this thing into motion because I felt the book wasn’t getting enough PR, and I wanted to keep the price down. Well, the price was knocked down to $2.25, and it got PR out the whazoo. And the reception to the book has been wildly positive. Now it’s entirely possible that sales will promptly rebound in response to that reception and we settle in around the mid-40s. But let’s say for a moment that they don’t. Let’s say that in the end we wind up with exactly the same number of copies being sold that we had when we started. If that’s the case, Bill Jemas can turn around and say, “It’s obvious that fans simply aren’t interested in supporting an ongoing CAPTAIN MARVEL title, even at $2.25 and with lots of publicity. Apparently Peter David can’t write stories that excite people the way other writers do.” Or he could even be “generous” and say, “Obviously people aren’t interested in reading about CAPTAIN MARVEL no matter how well it’s written.” And he cancels the title as of issue #7, having done everything he said he would and still proven his point.
So, y’know…food for thought amidst the congratulatory feasts.
PAD
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Color me naive, but those numbers reflect retailer purchases, not actual popularity among readers, yes?
I was informed by my local pusher — er, comic shop proprietor — that he and others had assumed sales on Green Arrow would slide when Kevin Smith left. Instead, customer demand for Brad Meltzer’s work has been at least as high.
Of course, the question is how does BJ interpret “sells most copies.” IANAL (that is, I is anal), but I would ask if he’s decided yet whether he means:
Highest selling for any single issue vs. highest selling summed over all six issues vs. sales figures on issue 6 (assuming that to be a plateau).
Number sold to retailers vs. number sold to customers
??
And of course, as I recall, he didn’t pledge to cancel the lowest of the lot, either.
Just a few thoughts on Peter David in general, and Captain Marvel in particular. I’m a poor person (who’s been addicted to comics for nearly 50 years), so I have to budget what I buy. I never bought the Hulk because I was REALLY poor for a long time and didn’t much like the character anyway. I’ve often enjoyed PAD’s writing in the past (really enjoyed DC’s Star Trek), but have avoided him in recent years due to subject matter. And truthfully, I read the ST book “Q2” and didn’t enjoy it at all.
I didn’t buy Captain Marvel at first because I had no interest in the character (liked his Dad though), but when the big hoo-haa started I checked it out–bought ALL the back issues and mostly enjoyed the series. I like Rick & Marlo (hate Moondragon) and wish they would get back together (why can’t any married couple in comics actually stay together?–if I wanted “real life” problems I wouldn’t read comics!). But I still don’t care for Captain Marvel as a character (sure, he’s an alien with different morals and such–sorry, don’t like him). I’ll keep buying the comic, mostly to support PAD in his fight against the corporate mind (or whatever you’re fighting for–sorry, I’m not much of a rebel).
As for the other two titles in this “contest”, I thought Ultimate Adventures was interesting, but I’m not sure which way it’s going–spoof or serious. Marville was pathetic. Haven’t wasted my money on writing that bad since Marvel’s “What The!?” many years ago.
Anyway, sorry this is so long winded. Keep up the good work and all that.
>>Haven’t wasted my money on writing that bad since Marvel’s “What The!?” many years ago.<<
Which amuses, since PAD wrote a few issues of “What The…!?” back in the day.
What about the chances of some more trades to support it?
It must be so frustrating as a writer. I recently read the Jones Hulk TPB and I enjoyed it, but it was no more or less than the X-files. “The End” and “Future Imperfect” were genuinely moving. I don;t understand. Captain Marvel has also been a book trying to do work on a real empathetic level. But look at DCs The Spectre: This book id hands down well written and drawn. Yet its sales have been plummeting. I really don’t understand. Saying it’s subjective just doesn’t cover it. Very frustrating.
The current Diamond system is atrocious.
I’d assume the significant drop between #1 & #2 is largely the result of having multiple covers for #1. Retailers probably ordered close to equal numbers of each of the three covers for #1, not knowing which cover might draw the most demand/attention and expecting that some CM readers were likely to buy multiples just to get the variant covers. With #2, their orders are probably more reflective of what they expected (and of course at that point no one knew actual demand for #1) for continued sales of the series. Isn’t 33,000 almost a 7,000 increase over the last issues of the previous volume? I wouldn’t call a 25% increase in orders exactly terrible; even if it isn’t enough to guarantee everlasting life for the series.
The important thing now is whether or not CM is selling out and having people coming in and looking for it. Orders for #4 (and maybe #3 – I think #1 was on the shelves before orders for #3 had to be placed. Not by much tho & #3 again had multiple versions.) will probably be a better indicator of how the book is really selling to customers. Altho actually with that reduction in orders, #5 & #6 may be even better since it’s more likely retailers will sell out of #2 than #1 and the need to increase their orders may not be recognized until ordering #5 or #6 (especially if they placed continuing declining orders for #3 before even knowing how well #1 was actually going to sell).
Unfortunately I’m still waiting for my #1 – the big drawback of using mailorder for my regular purchases. 🙂
I guess you could say I’m part of the problem, both for the future of Captain Marvel, and for comics in general. I bought the first issue of the Captain Marvel reboot, and didn’t buy issue #2. I won’t buy #3, or #4, or any other number following. Why? Because I finally decided to stop buying “pamphlet” comics.
After buying comics steadily for 20+ years, I came to the conclusion that it’s cheaper and more enjoyable to read comic stories in trade format. Easier to store, too. Gimmicks, like constant reboots and alternate covers and all of that don’t interest me in the slightest anymore. I just want to read the stories, and have done with it.
Comics today are (on average) better-written, better-drawn, and better-presented than at any point in the past. They’re also outrageously expensive, and seem to be written specifically for collection later on. So why bother going into the shop once a week to get a sliver of what will eventually be a reasonably-priced trade paperback?
I never thought I’d say this with surety, but the day of the pamphlet comic is gone. When they cost fifteen cents, great, but when they cost two bucks and up and up and up, they’ve passed the point where they’re worth the expense and effort required to collect and read them.
Why are sales slacking? Because people have less money they’re willing to commit to the hobby, and some (like me) are dropping out entirely. And it isn’t because we don’t like comics. Quite the opposite. We’re simply tired of being treated as if we have limitless resources, and we’re cutting our losses.
I still feel that a great deal of publicity is found in cameos and guest-appearances. There are simply too many people that will not by a title for a character until they have a feel for who they are or what they represent. While I think the U-Decide will ultimately aid and sustain Captain Marvel as a title, the fact that he is all but ignored in the outstandting Marvel Universe does not bode well for his longevity.
Sneak peaks tend to garner curiousity.
Well, I’m one who’s buying the new series who just didn’t get the old one (although I loved The HULK run). So you’ve added one reader, for what it’s worth… 🙂
[b]”Number sold to retailers vs. number sold to customers”[/b]
This figure does not exist on a industry wide basis. The comic companies themselves do not ask us (pushers) how much of our orders that we sell, and since Marvel has no re-orders there is no way to gauge sell-through by Diamond. I’m sure that DC and the others can garner some idea of how a book sells through by the re-order numbers (DC repeatedly shows this by going back to press on issues).
The figures that J & Q would use for this stunt would have to be from initial orders only, the question is… Number of copies sold? Sales in dollars? or some other half-baked idea to come up with “winners” and “losers” in this stunt.
jeff
I personally didn’t care when Captain Marvel was first said to be coming out, but I heard that PAD was going to be writing it. So, I gave the book a chance. I ended up really loving the book.
Ironically, I still don’t like Cap. Marvel as a character, but I love reading the interaction between him and Rick.
Peter:
I have been with you since your early days (Spiderman, the Phantom mini-series), and am proud to admit that I have been buying Supergirl and Captain Marvel since their respective issue ones.
Whatever happens: keep writing, and I’ll keep reading.
I cannot believe that anyone who’s read CM #1, does not buy the second issue. This story is fantastic!
James said, “So why bother going into the shop once a week to get a sliver of what will eventually be a reasonably-priced trade paperback?”
Just want to say I agree 100%. I buy only tpbs (ususally through Borders or amazon.com) and though I am a little upset that I miss out on some good books, my wallet and my bookshelf are happier, and I am still getting my four-color fix!
Hmm, looking at two of the quotes above:
“What about the chances of some more trades to support it?”
and
“So why bother going into the shop once a week to get a sliver of what will eventually be a reasonably-priced trade paperback?”
So, we don’t want to buy individual issues because they’ll be in a TPB, but we can’t buy the TPBs because they don’t exist…
On the sales front, I assume that retailers placed orders for #2 before they knew how many people bought #1, so it’s all pretty much guesswork. The only thing we (as readers) can really do is place a subscription at the store, rather than buying a copy off the shelf each month, in the hope that the retailer will then order more copies (with guaranteed sales).
Personally, I’ve just gone back to university to do a post-grad course, so I’m cutting back on which comics I buy. I will try to write to the companies though, and say “I’m not dropping this title because I don’t like it”, so that they have some feedback.
must… continue… to… order… multiple… copy… *gasp*
While the orders so far aren’t encouraging, there is still some hope. The drop off is caused primarily by retailers estimating how many copies will sell. Because of the 3 month lag between order and distribution issue 4 will be the first one where orders will be based on readers opinions of the revamp. So in theory the sales COULD increase. Realistically though, this isn’t very common.
Unfortunately good writing (and I do think this revamp contained some very good writing)is not the sole arbitor of what sells. Even a low price, good art and lots of PR aren’t.
There are plenty of other uncontrollable elements such as people’s perceptions of a character, how “hot” a creator is currently and of course the totally unknown and unguessable Z factor which randomly blesses or curses comics sales for no readily apparent reason.
Its clearly true that in the sadly tiny comics market these days there isn’t much room for marginal titles at the big companies.
All of which means that while it doesn’t look too good for Captain Marvel, that isn’t neccessarily anyone’s fault.
People have been hitting it on the head. As a retailer, I had to order my issues of #2 before #1 even hit the shelves. My order for #2 is higher than my order traditionally ever were before the relaunch. The one thing that might have helped issue #1 and #2 sales, was if there was more information on all of the u-decide titles before order time (preview books, art pages or something). The total lack of information for all of the looks left me with a sick feeling towards Marvel (especially considering the ultra-low quality of Marville).
Unfortunetly, based on reader reaction in my store, I had to drop the order for #3 closer to pre-relaunch numbers. As much as I like (and push) Peter David in everything he does, I’m thinking a lot of readers have a real problem connecting with Captain Marvel. The most common comment from people I get, is that they read everything Peter David does, but they hate Captain Marvel as a character and concept. Most readers in my stores do not want space super here’s (ROM, CM, Quasar). This is sad, and I really like the book, but I’m am really worried we won’t be seeing it for too much longer. If I thought me just ordering extra copies might save it, I would…
All of which means that while it doesn’t look too good for Captain Marvel, that isn’t neccessarily anyone’s fault.
I agree, especially not Peter David’s fault, as I think he has done a tremendous job with a mediocre character. CM’s like Aquaman,…doesn’t matter how good the story or the writer is, he’s still a guy who talks to fish…